Thursday, February 12, 2009

True Women Verus Feminists ... Here we go again!

Posted by Hannah at 10:39 AM

I wanted to talk about some articles I have seen regarding the New Women’s Conference.

First off I don't consider myself to be a Feminist. Secondly, I have to giggle at the definitions of feminism I hear about in the churches today anyway. Did you ever notice they use the most extreme examples, and just assume that most of the world accepts these models? How they are man haters, thinking they are the superior beings, and how they hate children, etc. Why the extremes?

They seem to be using the same tactics as that Virginia Slim commercial example used at the True Women Conference. Virginia Slims wanting to break into the market so they used tactics that will make you remember them! True Women conference showed you how that brand of feminism goes to far, and has torn apart the families.

If you have to use extreme examples of feminism to me you don't have much of a point. Its like they use the extremes as a scare tactic, and to try to coerce you into their other 'extreme' model of womanhood. I guess I will never understand that. It doesn't make sense to me, and as the saying goes IT doesn't compute!

Kathryn Joyce wrote another article about, "Women’s Liberation Through Submission: An Evangelical Anti-Feminism Is Born". She spoke about the True Woman Conference ’08 in Chicago, where they promote what its proponents call “biblical womanhood"! It’s a good article, and worth the read. Check it OUT!

I have actually gone to the True Women’s site, and listened to the audios they provided from the conference. I don't have a problem if you have this idea in your head of how you feel scripture is calling you to live your life okay? I don't like it when people say their definition is the TRUE one, and then use their opinions to mention how if you don't agree you are in the camp with the Virginia Slims Advertisements. To me it’s too black and white!

FeministsCompanies like Virginia Slims use all kinds of tactics to get their brand across. I realize at the time they were trying to get the message across that women were a bit more empowered than what they gave themselves credit for. Virginia Slims even crossed the line to dare to say MAYBE woman are the stronger gender. It was a tactic for their brand recognition, and I'm sure there are people that believe that as well. I don't believe MOST believe that.

I mean lets get real here men and women are different. No better no worse - different. It’s like comparing apples and oranges to me. To say we need to go back to the time pictured on the top of the Virginia Slims ad, and not be that arrogant liberated woman on the bottom to be 'true women' of Christ is hogwash! You aren't an extreme feminist just because you don't go along with their agenda. From what I heard a lot of what they are suggesting would take us backwards personally.

The message at the conference is that feminism went to far in the wrong direction, but if you look at history the place of 'true women' wasn't going the right direction in the past either. You may have had the 'Let it to Beaver' types of homes, but you also had ones that lived in the dark side like ones filled with domestic violence. It those days domestic violence was a family matter remember? Heck even child abuse and molestations were ignored, and swept under the carpet.

You didn't talk about it, but that doesn't mean it wasn't there. I hear so many talk about how things are worse now, and I have to disagree! I do remember those days myself, so NO I’m not some young whipper snapper talking trash here! Just because we ignored it doesn't mean it wasn't present. You didn't report it, you didn't act on it, and you didn't do much to stop it either. Can we say wrong direction? I’m not saying we do things CORRECTLY all the way today, but it is better in a lot of areas when it comes to the ‘social ills’ that we pretended wasn’t there at all in the past!

What has happened to men? is a video interview with Danny Silk. It seems he has a different view on this issue. After I got finished listening to this man speak to the younger man I thought HE is the FEMINIST (giggling to myself of course)! I'm sure others would take what he is trying to get across as wimping out, and letting the women run over all the men...because they NOW have to have power and control! I don't think that is what he was getting at all. I'm NOT saying he couldn't have said it better in certain portions of his message, but I think I get where he is going...

The video starts with the question,

"What has happened to men in modern times?"

Christian men? or all men? or what?

Well I guess especially Christian men, but generally all men. Wouldn't you say that something has happened to men in general in the last 50 or 100 years? There isn’t a big difference from the thousands of years before?

SURE! I think the big dynamic is changing and excelling is that men now have to deal with powerful women. Men have never had to deal with that before. They never even had to consider honoring and respecting a powerful woman. So when it’s a man's world...MEN make the rules! BUT soon as women and children become powerful men have to refine their role and their dynamic of interacting with someone who ... that has a new authority or a new respect.

Much like when minorities are empowered within a society. Just one generation ago we had a very different relationship with African Americans that our generation does now. So there were no tools that are sent to the next generation. This generation has to create their own tools on how to function in healthy relationships with now an EMPOWERED people group!

So men are going to ... we are going to have to grow in learning to cultivate connections and relationships without the threat of punishment. Without the dynamic of control and domination, and really that is Heaven come to earth is when you start introducing FREEDOM, LOVE, HONOR we change the dynamics of how people relate.

So generations past got away with a lot of disrespect, because small groups of people made all the rules. Now we now have a broader base of power. The Internet is empowering people like never before! An acceleration of people expecting to become freer and freer, and become more and more powerful. They have more options - More choices. The freedom of wealth that is accelerating the offer of wealth, and lots of choices!

Is like heaven training.... freedom training. So men had better learn how to train their children in FREEDOM and not in control and limitations. Men had better learn to love their wife’s, because like never before divorce is an option to women. It’s not a punishment. It’s not a social rejection. It’s not a financial punishment. So more than ever a woman can choose whom she will stay married to.

I don’t' care what your theology is! You can say, "We don't say the D word!' or "We don't have the option of divorce!" You need to shut up for a minute, because they do have the option to divorce and they are using it like crazy! Two thirds of all divorces are filed by women. Women in droves are trying to get away from men who don't know how to love. So if men don't learn how to love this trend will just corrode.

Wow that isn't the answer I was expecting....AT ALL!

Women do have more freedoms than they ever had before, and some men may have not learned to adapt to this change yet. I say some men because there are men out there that have! There are women in powerful positions, but I don't think he is talking about control freak type of power. Women didn't have the option of divorce, but men pretty much always did.

He is correct if you remember just a generation ago how the African Americans were viewed and treated compared to today. Perfect? NO! It would be unheard of back then to have an African American President! I have to say I doubt it would have happened to be perfectly honest with you. If it was attempted I can see certain areas of the country making sure those ‘blacks’ didn’t leave their homes come election day, and THEY would have got away with it also!

Women HAVE come a long way BABY! That doesn’t mean women are trying to take control, and make men more like women. YES it may mean you can’t rule with an iron fist like in days past, but if you truly think about it…that was a sinful way of ruling! Women were trapped in a lot of ways they aren’t trapped with now.

I was surprised to hear a man speak like he did as well. I think there is a huge difference between basic human freedoms that women should have had long ago, and what those women at the conference enjoy by way ... and the extreme feminist view of women that True Women conference is attempting to use. You can still live by biblical principals, and women can still enjoy basic human rights as well. You can still have the masculine man, and the feminine woman! It doesn’t stop that from happening! A man that learns to love as the example Mr. Silk gave doesn’t make a man LESS of a man! I think most men realize that as well. Our world isn’t perfect, but we don’t need to pigeonhole women so men can feel more MASCULINE! We would be less of a woman! God doesn’t intend either gender to be LESS than to make the other FEEL more gender specific!

Personally, I would side with the feminists if I had to choose between the options of their ‘true woman’. Woo HOO! We have come a long way BABY!

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zoeygirl on 3:08 PM said...

Wow. I have to be honest, I'm speechless to hear those words come out of the mouth of a Christian leader! Praise God!

In these past couple of years as I'm going through a divorce, I'm realizing that the church's focus on "eliminating" divorce is the wrong answer! A case in point--last year Rick Warren of Saddleback Church got so disgusted with the divorce rate in his church that he started some short-term Bible study for couples in crisis. I don't know the outcome of it, but I remember thinking that a quick Bible study was not going to change my abuser! While a Bible study isn't necessarily a bad thing, it doesn't go to the root of the problem--if it did, my abuser would have changed many times over because he went to a lot of Bible studies.

It is not divorce in and of itself--it is the heart attitudes of the people in the marriage which LEAD to divorce--which in my case was a man who desired to dominate and control me, not love me. My ex learned to be a controller from his father--and Danny Silk is SO right--if you want to change men, you need to train them in the right way from their youth to respect powerful women.

If the church wants to eradicate the symptom of divorce--they need to look to the CAUSE, not the SYMPTOM. Divorce is the SYMPTOM of people not loving and honoring themselves first and their spouses second.

Oh Lord, will this message ever be embraced by your church?

Hannah on 3:30 PM said...

''they need to look to the CAUSE, not the SYMPTOM.'''

AMEN to that Zoeygirl!

I have to wonder if his bible study wasn't successful as they had hoped. I'm sure it would be selling like hotcakes if it was!

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