I have been reading opinions about the latest Eminem song, called, "Love The Way You Lie". (Video Link highlighted)
Some people say they 'get' the song, and others feel it glamorizes domestic violence. I found a short interview with Rihanna, and the part that bothered me is her almost childlike response, "I wanted to be part of a HIT!"
I tried for a number of weeks to figure out WHERE the attraction was for this song, and how it is strange that none of them (Characters in the video) truly try to explain the message behind it. Rihanna got the snot kicked out of her, and I can't believe that she would truly wish to 'glamorize' what happened to her.
WELL below is my STAB at a theory!
Lets look at the chorus of the song:
Just gonna stand there and watch me burn
But that's alright because I like the way it hurts
Just gonna stand there and hear me cry
But that's alright because I love the way you lie
I love the way you lie
This is the first part I think some are truly bothered by. WHY would she said such a thing? I like the way it hurts? I like the way you lie? Huh?
To me personally? It sounds like opinions towards victims of domestic violence from society. She must like it or why wouldn't she leave? She must have done something to trigger him like that! She isn't innocent after all.
I'm talking about how those justifications we read about after she got beat up, and had to listen to people justifying Chris Brown actions towards her. She PUSHED him to beat her.... right? Abusers for the most part are out for themselves, and in their sick viewpoints towards the relationship? Watching her cry or burn isn't something that moves them in reality.
For the chorus she is playing the part that society had labeled her with. I'm not talking ALL of us, but the ones that stood up for Chris Brown in a fashion that justified what he did to her. How she pushed his buttons, and she loves the way he lies. Why else would she stay in a relationship with him? RIGHT?!
maybe he was defending himself against her
WHY YALL ON RIHANNA SIDE HE HIT HER FOR A REASON SHE MIGHT HAVE DID SUMTHIN TO **** HIM OFF OR PUSH HIM TO HIS LIMIT
im guessing that rhianna hit him first and if she did, then she got what she deserved.
We have heard cruel attitudes towards victims, and maybe Rihanna is playing the part they asked her to in the chorus. It was the opinion of society towards her, and it shows to THEM at least she has twisted thoughts towards the relationship as well.
I have been reading about the interview with Rihanna that Good Morning America did with Diane Sawyer. I haven't seen the interview, but from what I have taken from clips and quotes? She speaks very well of a dynamic of domestic violence that most people hear about, but you don't truly see represented within the church. Nor do most people even recognize as part of the dynamics of the relationship even within the secular world.
Rihanna also dealt deftly with the elephant in the room: why she initially went back to Brown after the beating.
"It's pretty natural for that to be the first reaction . . . to go back and start lying to yourself," she told Sawyer. Her love for Brown certainly factored in. "I fell in love with that person . . . so far in love, so unconditional, that I went back." When Sawyer said abused women go back, on average, seven times before they leave, Rihanna corrected her, saying it was typically eight or nine times.
Chances are when women go to their pastors or the church they have already done the 'go back home and submit harder'. Matter of fact they have done the 'hit and hug' dance many times in different ways. Most people think when I say HIT its physical, but anyone that has been in an abusive relationship (man, woman or child) knows the controlling behavior, emotional abuse, and verbal abuse were very heavy smacks as well.
I was doing a little reading the other night, and I came across the blog called Duh Daily Scoop. The author reprinted an article by By Valerie Strauss of the Washington Post. The article was called, "A Call for Clergy to Spotlight Domestic Abuse".
Glenn F. Ivey is a State's Attorney for Maryland, and he wanted to get out the word about domestic violence. As we know October is Domestic Violence Month in the United States, and he made a couple of calls to the churches so they could take the lead. He figured it would be a 'slam dunk' as they call it. It will be an easy sell! HOW hard could this be right?
"But no, I heard things like: 'Brother, it's a little hot to talk about that one.' Or, 'Well, I'll take it up, and we'll form a task force and get back to you.' . . . And then there are churches where the response to the victim is, 'You have to stick it out.' "
Glenn Ivey is a man that wishes to help the 'weaker vessel' within churches, and the church basically turned their backs on the State of Maryland, Glenn Ivey, and women that he wishes to help. What a 'holy' slap in the face huh? We aren't talking about a few little small towns, or neighbors here after all! We are talking about an entire STATE within the USA, and their churches decided that domestic violence really wasn't a topic they wanted to deal with right now.
The article goes on to say:
On Sunday, gatherings will be held at churches -- including Ebenezer AME Church in Fort Washington -- and community-based organizations across the region for "Project Safe Sunday," an initiative aimed at getting people to talk about the sometimes-taboo subject of domestic violence. President Obama has designated October "National Domestic Violence Awareness Month."
The goal is to help people understand the serious and complicated problem and to spur them to learn how to help themselves and others get out of an abusive relationship.
Mr. Ivey speaks about one of his revelations about how people just can't seem to approach this subject when news came out about Chris Brown and Rihanna. We all know they talked about it, but how they wrap their minds around the reality of domestic abuse? It seems that took him by surprise.
At least initially, a large contingent of people thought that Rihanna was guilty until proven innocent. Not only were they willing to defend Brown, but they also seemed convinced that she must have done something to "deserve" being beaten. Even after a tabloid released photographs of Rihanna showing extensive bruises and swelling, some persisted in defending Brown. Her decision to reunite with him after the photos were published was seen in some quarters as confirmation that she had somehow wronged him from the beginning.
He was speaking to a many of middle school students about this crime, and he was surprised at the reaction of the children. It was the same, and the stats, stories and whatever else he could show them was basically lost to his audience of children.
The surprising comment that he made finally got these children to stop and think for a moment!
Finally, exasperated, I blurted out, "Do you think Barack would ever hit Michelle like that?"
Everyone in the room froze. One student weakly suggested that "Michelle is big enough to fight back," but I knew I had them then.
"Even if she were a foot shorter, can you ever imagine Barack hitting Michelle?" I pressed on: "Is there anything she could possibly do that would lead you to think she deserves to get beaten?"
At that point, the debate was over. Putting hands on Michelle Obama was somehow unthinkable.
Mr. Ivey commented about how the domestic violence issue needed someone like Michelle Obama to step up and support it. He also mentioned that maybe this was to much of a hot topic even for her. No matter what your political party lines are can you imagine the impact that would have? The fact that domestic violence rips people's lives apart, and that isn't falling along gender lines either! Generations of families dealing with this, and for some? Domestic violence is far too controversial to make that commitment.
He closes:
But this sort of campaign is clearly needed. The Centers for Disease Control and Prevention reports that about 1,200 deaths occur each year as the result of domestic violence. Nearly 2 million attacks annually don't result in death but can be nearly as devastating -- such as what happened to Yvette Cade of Clinton in October 2005, when her estranged husband set her on fire. The Chris Brown/Rihanna case is the sort of domestic violence that I see nearly every day in my job as a prosecutor.
On top of all this, the ripple effects of violence continue to rip apart families and distort young minds. Many of the killers that come through my courthouse have a history of domestic violence in their homes. It will take powerful forces to break that generational curse.
For years groups have sought to reduce domestic violence nationwide. We would all benefit from the credibility and charisma that the first lady would bring to these efforts. Perhaps with her help, we could reverse recent trends and reduce domestic violence in America.
I have to wonder if it will take someone like Michelle Obama for people to truly stop and listen. It seems to me that the church is afraid to use our most powerful source GOD as the motivator!
I see people searching for the grey area so they really don't have to deal with the meat of the issue. Recently I wrote about one of the red herrings that stop them, and that would be the 'authority' within the home.
I truly feel people are afraid of opening this can of worms.
Its a can of worms that God would wish to be dealt with, but we humans use scripture as reasons we don't.
You also see this in history all the time.
From Bitter waters to Sweet mentions how Christians used scripture to justify slavery for example! We can't even imagine that today, but it was accepted and believed!
A Wife's Submission talks about Nate Phelps, and how his well known father Fred Phelps uses 1 Corinthians 11 as a tool of terror towards the women in his family. How he can use this power to take away their salvation. Nate Phelps has now completely turned his back on his faith.
Its just like the stories you find about the sexual abuse within the church that Because It Matters brings to our attention. People are so taken back and hurt by the stories they accuse others of 'judging' and remind them that they are a NICE person. They are a man of God. They just can't face they are a fallen man of God. The accusers are normally placed on the hot seat at that point as people search for flaws in their character to use as the excuse. They just can't place the fact that this person can do this using their own freewill. You can't heal broken people if you can't face the fact they are broken to begin with! IT doesn't happen in MY church...afterall!
We have all heard the sermons and read the articles about commitment. How we have covenants that we are fulfill. Men and Women that are abused are asked to fulfill a commitment and covenant by themselves, because their abusers aren't capable of that. What makes it harder is that society it seems can't seem to OWN that fact that they are not capable either. I will admit society is further along in loads of aspects when it comes to the 'world' versus domestic violence within the church!
Sadly, I think Glenn F. Ivey does have a point. It will take someone like Michelle Obama to start the push for the world to see the reality of this sin.
Its not due to being 'provoked' as people love to say.
Its due to two broken people that have separate issues they need to face and deal with.
Sadly, in alot of cases? They may never see it, because the world refuses to. The 'healthy' ones can't point it out, and help because its just to controversial. I guess its easier to blame the broken people. It would be to UN-politically correct to truly look deeper. The next time I hear, "That would never happen in MY church!" I hope they aren't Maryland! If they are I wonder if they will go as far as to ask about the invitation from Glenn Ivey! You know! Check to see if the denial is NOT in YOUR church! I can't believe Maryland is the one and only!
Chris Brown's demeanor changed a bit at the beginning of this portion of the interview.
He claims he still loves her at the beginning of the interview. I have no doubt he does still love her in his own way. He hasn't got the help he needs to recognize a healthy type of love yet.
I think most anyone would feel sorrow once a person they love moves on to a new relationship. He won't be stalking her to much with the media following him. You can bet the minute she gets hot and heavy with someone else it will fuel the media once again. Sigh. I think that is the nature of the beast.
He may not be in a relationship at this point, but you can't tell me he doesn't accept the attention of other ladies.
Abusers do know how to play that part of the game as well.
They will tell the new woman the lines he knows will work, and concentrate on telling her how much more lovely she is compared to you know WHO! WELL at least until she ticks him off, and then the comparisons will go into another direction.
Abusers also like to tell the victim they don't LOVE them like they LOVED YOU! AGAIN until she ticks him off, and then he will announce how this other person is so much better for them.
The 'changed' part? The motive is there, and no change is present. There are people that will see this, but victims that are broken and used to the cycle don't always see it. It hurts when you point it out, but it helps them see the reality of things as well.
CHRIS BROWN'S VIDEO AFTER THE FACT
Yeah, I’m tellin’ you. We not, we not. And I don’t do all this talkin’ on the thing, this just some new stuff I’m doin’, I wanna say what up. ‘Cause I ain’t been out there in a minute. But. New album gonna be comin’ soon. We workin’ on that right now. It’s called Graffiti, got everything on it, know what I’m sayin’? So y’all be ready for that. I’m about to drop a single this summer for y’all, so. We ain’t goin’ nowhere. Everybody that hate us, they just been haters. All my real fans, I love y’all. I ain’t a monster.
As I mentioned in the prior article he isn't going to attempt to sway those that may accept what happened, and doubt his sincerity of his apology when you act like this.
Its easier to say, "Everyone that hate us, they just been haters!" He refuses to acknowledge in any REAL terms why people may be upset with him! You hold on to the upset - you are JUST HATERS!
There truly is no REAL vulnerability. They just can't do that when they are that broken. That is NOT to say it can never happen, but at this point? You aren't going to see it. Its much easier to accept that people just lie, and never liked him to begin with, etc.
GRANTED there are THOSE of course! His cocky demeanor and arrogance that is spilling all over the place isn't going to do much for his case. The fact that his support system is MORE than willing to participate in this video? They are okay with him not having to be vulnerable, sincere, and accept his lumps as well.
He might have been VERY angry at the bloggers, but again his lack of self control? His lack of impulse control? WOW I guess it happened a second time now. What Rhianna's actions were 10 times worse than the bloggers now?
MY REAL FRIENDS!
You know WHO his real friends are at this point? The ones that allowed themselves to take what he says and accept it hook, line and sinker. Those are the TRUE friends! He doesn't like the supporters of Rhianna especially if they got to vocal.
For interviews he may say he understands, and is okay with it. His demeanor and the fact he keeps coming back to that? How if you don't accept him you are just haters? That's part of the abusers black and white world. There are those that will think he is a monster, and will hate him forever and NEVER allow the sincere, humble nature when he does get real. Chris Brown isn't there yet. He isn't anywhere close to that.
Part of the acceptance is admitting that some people do have a reason to 'hate' as he puts it. They do have reason to be mad! They do have reasons to question his sincerity. Some may waffle back and forth, some may accept things and be okay with it, and some may hate him until the day he dies.
The fact he is only okay with the one group - his supporters 100% of the time? The TRUE fans? Its shows the nature of the abuser. He loves that he can have some sense of control over them. The rest of them? Contempt. You either you understand my side 100% or you are the enemy! That's clue one they are crawling back into their abuser world. There is no humble nature over the sin he has committed.
The monster within him is still there. I hope he does get help with the monster, because he is kidding himself if he thinks that part of him will never surface again. He may not be a monster all the time, but there is a monster under the surface. If he wants help he needs to accept that.
He mentions how when they went to his friend's house after the domestic violence situation it wasn't to 'rekindle the relationship', but to build the 'friendship' back up. It was like Romeo and Juliet trying to get together as they were kept apart. Huh?
How many healthy people in the world would wish to rekindle their friendship after someone beats the living snot out of them...and NOT talk about what happened during that time? How they are just there to 'relax', and just be friends. LOL How you just get together JUST for that, and not feel just a bit awkward? He claims it wasn't at all! Reasonable people would feel awkward don't you think?
WHY DID YOU DO THAT?
She never asked WHY he beat her up, and he never mentioned it due to him 'not remembering it'. He claims they didn't want the pressure of that conversation! They just wanted to relax, and what?? lol play like nothing ever happened?
People that are abusive that realize there is a chance they can't get the relationship back on track to where they want it will attempt the 'can we be friends?"
Part of relationships is resolution after disagreements.
He beat her up, and yet he claims she never asked him WHY he hurt her? I guess he never felt the need to tell her either.
Part of the reason you don't go into these parts of discussions with abusers is they get very defensive. That's to close for comfort for them, and when you think about it ... it isn't a communication problem at all. Its a resolution one!
They don't wish to go into detail, and if they said they were sorry don't push it.
If you decide you can't be friends? WELL you can't forgive and all you want to do is hate! THEY will of course forgive you as many times as possible, but since you are unable you will be the problem.
It goes back to you need to own part of the issue I hit you to begin with. If you aren't going to be my lover you need to be my friend! If you can't be my friend...they will TURN on you!
ALWAYS A SENSE OF URGENCY
There is always a sense of urgency. You can't have time to think about it. To the abuser there is nothing to think about. YOU must decide instantly or they have made up their minds about you.
Abusers don't like that wiggle room, because its easier to break you down if you give in to the sense of urgency. They can also point out how you can't be all that sincere about the 'friend' part if question anything in the future. Its a tool they use to get you back, and they can STILL have some sense of control.
They can't do this 'change' without YOU! The real reason? They don't want to, and they WON'T if you don't give in to them in many cases. They aren't doing it to better themselves they are doing it so you will mellow out! They can show the world they are doing something, and I'm a nice guy since she will be my FRIEND see?
If you don't help there are threats of maybe 'killing themselves' or hurting others. The threats come out about how they will TAKE everything from you, and spread falsehoods about you. They will take you court over everything, and threaten to get custody of the children.
You do it their way and be friends...or you will pay the consequences! That is a very REAL dynamic, and if you don't have a good support system? All kinds of things will happen. They could go back due to fear, or play the REAL dance of that REAL abuser!
DO YOU EVER THINK SOMETHING IS WRONG WITH YOU??
Chris Brown thinks there is nothing WRONG with him, because he just made a mistake. He can 'change'. Why do you 'change' if nothing is wrong with you?
You can see clearly he doesn't wish to OWN that root within him that can be downright evil! That doesn't MEAN you are 100% evil - it means you have a part of you that can be!
You can't change anything if you can't OWN that about yourself! Think about it! Does a person that has a addiction NOT admit they are addicted and 'change' despite the fact they won't admit it? Can a person that gets 10 speeding tickets NOT admit he drives to fast?
I will give the man credit that he WANTS to learn about himself, and LEARN different ways to react to things. He wants to become a 'REAL' man as he worded it! I pray that he does! He has alot of work to do!
What doesn't help? His mother can't place any pieces together at all. Her denial isn't going to help his healing. She had to see things as well, and in real life like you and I live in? That person is going to help make OUR lifes miserable. You can't help yourself or anyone else if you can't admit things.
Can you truly be friends? Can you say it would be a safe thing to do at this point? They truly don't have the tools to do that, and victims normally can't deal with that in a healthy manner either. Resolution can bring healing, but what if that person is incapable...but insists on friendship? Do you seriously think that can be rock solid? If so FRIENDS who are we really kidding!
Chris Brown's reaction towards the beginning of the interview is pretty typical. In most cases abusers will NOT admit when things happened before, but when they get caught like he did? THAT was the first time! The relationship was pretty normal beforehand.
I realize people will RUSH to say the incidents that are mentioned were never proven. If it never happened would you react like he did? "I don't remember that happening." Most people will say, "THAT NEVER HAPPENED!"
The lawyer stated that the probation people took those incidents from different reports, and placed it in the present report. THAT doesn't mean it never happened! OH AND they never spoke to either of the parties about this.
Where did it come from then? Something was called to their attention, and if neither party told the probation department about it? What it fell out of the air? There seems to be a paper trail they don't want to talk about.
There doesn't have to be an arrest, etc for a paper trail to be there.
How? Think of a little old lady in your neighborhood calling the police because she thinks there is a stranger outside lurking! If something happens down the road that lady's report will surface. Paper trail!
That is why people mention to others to remember to call the police, and have them write things up even if nothing comes of it. That paper trail can come in handy later if it is needed to prove a pattern.
Remember with abusers? It never happened before! Its her word against MINE! No proof - no case! The paper trail would place that into question. You will see a pattern start to develop.
Police do place personal notes in there as well. The 'automatic' guilt isn't automatic, but at least you have a starting point. At times patterns of behavior are very useful if you need to point out a dangerous person.
Granted on this interview I can understand WHY he doesn't wish to go there, but people with any level of common sense? It should tell you things happened prior, and this incident didn't just FALL out of the sky.
I think I would remember taking out windshields wouldn't you?
At this point he has nothing to gain by admitting it. His reputation has already taken a HUGE hit, but it would follow the pattern of abuse wouldn't it?
WE HAD A HEALTHY, NORMAL RELATIONSHIP BEFORE THIS HAPPENED!
Notice how Chris spoke, his eye contact, body language, etc. I'm SURE the man is somewhat nervous, but he should be more comfortable than most in front of the cameras. He should be prepared for this interview. He should have had his script down pat beforehand! You can't tell me he didn't have a CLUE what would be asked!
As they say in sports? HE CHOKED!
He can't look people in the eyes. He can't speak. According to him they had this normal, healthy relationship. This one time? WELL out of the blue it just plain got out of control!
When abusers are in control they see the relationship as awesome! For them? Why would they see it any other way? When the POWER OVER aspect is present that is fuel, and they feed off it. It is normal to them, and to them also? A very GOOD relationship at that! I truly don't think they see the unhealthy aspect of it. They just can't own it, and why should they? Where is the incentive to? Being equal doesn't give them control. To them it makes them 'less than'. That can make a very unhealthy environment for both. If they can control it, and they get the fuel they feel they need? Why change it!
Don't get me wrong you can have GOOD aspects to these relationships. They are both so unhealthy they can't truly see the unhealthy parts.
MOM SAYS I'M OKAY!
Most of us realize that Chris Brown spoke of the domestic violence that happened in his childhood. His mother will admit these things happened as well.
The part she will NOT admit to? It had an impact on him. There is no way it could have NO impact at all.
Think of the story that is told about the two brothers. They had an abusive father, and were abused themselves. When they grew up one son was abusive towards his family, and other was the complete opposite of that. When they were asked WHY they treated their families as they did? What was their answer? They both answered the same. BECAUSE OF DAD!
Don't think if it was MOM that abused it would be any different! Abuse impacts children's lifes.
Chris Brown's mother claims her experiences, and what he dealt with in life didn't impact his life. It is NOT the case for her son. What happened was mind boggling to her. "He never fought in school?" First it was NO, but then it was SCUFFLES! Chris Brown then states it was NEVER against a female!
We see signs were there, and mom isn't helping here!
What did she say to him afterwards? I'm there for you, but when you are wrong I will let you know you are?
She said she will not judge her son, and will not judge anyone. That's all find and great, but she also isn't accepting the reality of things either. The lawyer admits some people never do, and then quickly diverts the conversation elsewhere.
The story got blown out of proportion, and falsehoods existed in those stories. We would show them HOW they were false and people would report them anyway. Breaking of the glass was vandalism not domestic violence! his lawyer commented in order to divert things ....
Larry King quickly stated, "But domestic violence DID happen!" "That's why he wanted to plead guilty right away, an apologize right away!" If you read the dynamics of the abuser? Its not as short, sweet and lovely as that!
I WANTED TO DO THE RIGHT THING!
Chris Brown states he wasn't going to go the easy way out like other celebrities, and take that slap on the wrist. He was willing to take the brunt of the punishment to show to the world HE won't allow himself to get away with anything.
He mentions that he had already spoken to Rhianna, and she accepted his apology. He wanted to show his fans he was sorry, and took responsibility.
NOT the ones that were MAD at him, but the ones that were behind him and would accept his apology.
What is wrong with that statement?
The fans that were outraged at being lied to don't count? The ones that felt betrayed aren't an issue? Is that truly stepping up?
I think we all realize that SOME will hold on to this like a death grip, but why take the easy way out and only apologize to ones that you KNOW will accept it? Why not attempt to go there with some of the others? You will NEVER get all of them that's reality, but why write them all off?
You could feel his contempt for them, and if he was sincere? That contempt wouldn't be there. That is a typical abusive trait. If you don't accept my apology than to heck with you!
When you look at the average couple that deals with this? The family members that have a hard time accepting their sorrow, etc are met with contempt from the abuser as well.
THEY are the ones that will help her break up their relationship.
THEY are the ones that are talking her into NOT forgiving ME!
THEY are the ENEMIES!
If a couple gets back together again? The abuser will isolate her away from them as well. THEY are a threat to the abuser! If the victim wishes to contact them? She is wrong and doesn't love and accept him the way she should. She will pay for that contact. Where is that sincerity now?
I'm NOT talking about people that LOVE to hate!
I'm talking about the people that question his sincerity. The ones that can see the lack of sincerity by his actions.
Chris Brown isn't truly willing to STEP up and take his lumps! Its easier for the him to cast them off, and not win their trust back.
In the case of an average abuser? If he can keep her away from them (support system) it makes it easier for him to keep control of her.
That resistance is a threat, and he DOES care about the threat he sees in them. He isn't willing to prove them wrong he wants them OUT of the picture, because he shouldn't have to. He said he was sorry, and did his speech...deal with it!
She knows what he is capable of, and isn't always capable of going against his will. He claims he has changed, but refuses to humble himself to others over what has happened. Is that truly change or another form of a snow job?
It never happened before?! RIGHHHHHHHHHT!
If Chris Brown was sincere in what he said he will care about the "FANS" that left, and he will come to his senses and STOP hating on THEM! If he can win them over with his sincere nature, and accept those that can't accept him due to the circumstances? Hmmmm. We might be looking at the start of a change. This 'my way or the highway' junk shows the opposite of that. Sorry Chris! NOT buying it!
I watched the Larry King interview with Chris Brown last night, and you could see the swell of denial that still is present. You can also see the typical response that alot of people see, and I hope that within time during their counseling times he/they become more enlightened than they seem to be now.
There are HUGE differences between how he/she had to deal with things compared to most of us, but I saw alot of similar items as well.
I skipped the first portion, because it was more of an introduction. If you would like to see it just click HERE
First off I don't have an issue with him NOT wishing to go into details that night. I don't think it is his place, but is Rhianna's place if she wishes to go there. I understand a reporter HAS to ask, but I was glad he didn't choose to go into what happened between them. If I were guessing it was more his lawyer's input not to, because abusers do like to get that portion out. It doesn't matter at this point anyway.
HE IS AN UNUSUAL ABUSER?
When the lawyer starts talking in the beginning about HOW its unusual for people that committed domestic violence to actually admit they beat someone up?
That's not odd to me.
Abusers will at first admit things at the time.
YES of course there are those that deny it, but we aren't talking about them presently.
We need to keep in mind there are different types, but to me his reaction isn't all that uncommon.
Hidden Hurt as a good section on the mindset of the abuser, but don't be like I was at the beginning and think ALL traits listed must be present. None of them are healthy, and if you think about it? They can all cause problems that can spiral out of control. Don't be like me to try to talk myself OUT of it by being to black and white! I was SO bad about that then! LOL!
What normally happens in those cases that abusers WISH to admit they abused? They want to reach out and apologize, and SURE they do show remorse at THAT time.
They want to talk to you, they want to apologize, and they want to tell you it will never EVER happen again.
If the victim isn't ready for that? It doesn't matter they MUST talk to them!
Chris Brown's lawyer among others told him he couldn't. You don't have that normally. If you listen to him? He tells you how badly he wanted that!
What I have seen happen to many times is when the apology is accepted to quickly the abuser will start on the BUT's to his apology.
BUT "You did push me"
or in this case BUT "You did throw the keys at me" or something like that.
To me it is part of getting the abusive dynamic back to where they are comfortable. I admitted my part now you admit yours.
It's not unusual for abusive people to do this to get the heat off them. They feel they have done their job (admitting and apology), and now you need to admit how you made them do it.
Taking 100% responsibility of the fact that violence should have never happened?
That portion disappears quickly, because the abuser got the victim to admit their ACTION was part of their RESPONSE.
That helps them gain control over the relationship again. Something that you do not want, and for the abuser's prospective not a healthy type BUT control.
They can't get any type of growth or healing until the day they can own up to the fact - you don't go there at all. The 'two to tango' plays right into their hands!
I realize within the church people do wish to look at this portion, but you have to realize its to early in the game for the abuser to allow this.
Its a tool in the abusers arsenal, and you don't hand it to them on a silver platter. You want them to see violence is never the way, and handing them excuses? They will give you lip service to agree...but you are also handing them an excuse NOT TO! They are going to play you as well! COUNT ON IT! Its part of their game!
Their motive is cool things off, and in their mindset? They are forced to abuse, and you don't want to enable that portion of the cycle.
DEAL with other parts of the dynamic later (victim's mindset/portion), and not within the abuser's presence. They are looking for excuses at this point!
They need to feel the brunt of their actions, and showing him HOW the other party did things to make them rage? You are handing them an excuse not to own the violence part.
I realize that sounds strange, but if you look over the whole scene you will understand what I'm driving at.
Lets take a drug dealer for an silly example!
They get arrested for dealing, and use the excuse WELL if people didn't buy I wouldn't SELL!
To them the buyers are responsible, and if they were NOT addicted he wouldn't have got arrested.
We all know that buyers (addicted people) need help as well, but you don't hand the dealer that as an excuse.
We have two different dynamics going on here, and we as a society tend to hand the abuser the dealers excuse for him to own. We are enabling him. We don't see how he is playing us.
Chris Brown's behavior is pretty typical, and follows the pattern.
If I were guessing due to the media breathing down his neck, and hounding him to see if any communication was made with Rhianna, etc the pressure for him NOT to contact was overwhelming. In their case? It was slowed down, but not stopped.
You have loads of people that had money riding on him.
He is a business transaction to them. We don't see that type of pressure with the average abuser.
Most people within that type of situation do not have the media spotlight on them to see what happens once communication starts once again. He has his career at stake and loads of money (both his and promoters of him), and he was going to follow the instructions of that HERD of people - just as she did.
Abusers/Victims don't normally have that type of pressure. Big difference - abusers have this urge that must be fulfilled!
Most of the time? Abusers don't have people that will stop them - or slow them down!
Does that make him 'unusual'? I hardly think so.
Abusers are going to push that communication card, and they don't even respect the fact that victims may wish NOT TO. When I watch abusers its like they are going to come OUT of their skin if they can't communicate.
When things are out of their control? That is the most UNCOMFORTABLE time for them. They MUST contact so they can 'talk to them'. (withdraw)
If you truly listen to them? They aren't genuine, and have motive behind that communication.
The fact they don't wish to respect the 'space' that she needs? That should send up red flags, but doesn't alot of the time.
The fact people need to encourage her NOT to contact as well? They do at first, but after time the support systems start to crack under the pressure as well!
THE DYNAMIC OF THE COUPLE
I had the feeling - as I'm sure others did at the beginning - that she wanted to contact him, and hear him out. This was hinted at during this interview as well. To me the dynamics between the people are not what others seem to see.
You have two people with a very unhealthy dynamic between them, and some almost go into (for lack of a better word) withdraw if they don't communicate.
Its an addiction in some ways. You don't get to see that part due to the police intervention at this point, and the fact the media is breathing down their necks. WELL not full blown anyway.
We do know later than phones calls, etc where made.
The best thing to happen is both parties go into no contact so they can fully absorb what has happened.
Normally, that doesn't happen at all. They are like the other persons drug. He needs his fix and she does also.
He needs the dynamic to go back to where he is comfortable, and she is hurt and confused...and wants him to show her it will be better. He will be better - he still loves her - they can fix this!
The love is toxic at this point, and neither can see its not healthy for them. The pressure of the situation? Their supporters don't enjoy the pressure cooker either, and at times rush to the communication portion so 'its over'. They played into the abusers dance, but most people don't even realize it.
What if this happened to an average couple?
She would be hurt, scared, and she would go someplace to lick her wounds.
After he comes down OFF his rage reality would slap him, and he will want to go to her and make it better.
His relationship could be a risk, and that honeymoon phase would start. The full blown honeymoon part didn't get to happen right away due to the spotlight here, and the legal team involved.
That's to say nothing of their image, career, etc. People are kidding themselves if they don't think those two wished to do that dance together FULLTIME.
In some situations you have victims that DON'T wish this contact, and want to be left alone.
The abusers anxiety level will push and push and PUSH her into engaging. If they can't get into her world he will send in the troops to do that for him. He will email, text, and call in order to break her down and have want he needs.
She is like a fix to him, and he will do anything - say anything to get that fix fulfilled.
To most people they can understand why she doesn't wish to contact him. If she sticks to the no contact rule that is when things get nasty.
The control level is threatened, and things can get downright dangerous. This is when I see alot of support systems tend to start to crumble under that pressure.
"Can you talk to him, and maybe you can calm him down!"
"Maybe if you just speak to him he will go away!"
The victim is used to being pressured, and she will fold. The problem is? That dangerous cycle starts up all over again once contact is ended once again.
That's why at first you STAY no contact, until people get stronger. You can't avoid this from happening, and she will realize how 'strong' her support system really is at this point.
Most of the time people don't understand, and use logic instead of education. That's where people get into trouble.
Abusers have extreme highs and lows. They can go from prince charming to your worse nightmare within a short period of time. The support system again starts to crumble, and blame can show its ugly face at that point.
WHY did you EVER get involved with this man in the first place!
What happened between the two of you that made him so full of rage?
If the supportive system helps with the 'no contact' mode they are sure to see the nasty side of him.
That is when she will start to fold, and want to make him feel better.
You will see her feeling responsible for his feelings, and you will see clearly her broken side in this.
Abusers will show the prince charming for a while to sweet talk everyone, but support systems will also feel like they might have stepped on a landmine if they don't cooperate.
Support systems on both sides are essential, and they both need to realize WHAT they are dealing with. Don't kid yourself into thinking it will be easy either.
I see this time as when most of the support systems get scared, and if their only vision is reconciliation and not healing? They are afraid he will leave and never return once he gets nasty.
Divorce at this point comes into their minds, and they want to rush to process since the situation has come unstable. They don't see they aren't helping either side of this relationship.
The relationship has always been unstable!
The victim is once again set adrift by herself. People don't start to feel the real danger until this happens, and they want to get the heck of dodge.
That true desire to help? The cost they feel is to high.
At times if she is strong enough to go against the crumbling support system - if she has one at all? Domestic violence shelters come into the picture, because no one else wants to take this on!
WHY WAS HE VIOLENT?
If you watch Chris Brown stumble over his words its clear he doesn't know. He says they were not taught the proper ways within a relationship, etc.
His lawyer goes into NOT learning of impulse control and the rest.
Why do they ask for anger management then? We are talking something WAY past anger management! You see that alot in churches - anger management. That is one portion of a huge picture.
Anger management to me its like giving medicine to someone with depression, and ignoring the core issues WHY the depression is there to begin with!
When you take the edge off only? You don't deal with the core, and you deal with the surface stuff only. Could be way some of these programs don't cut it.
ATTITUDE of the abusers I would guess is a huge chuck as well! They are forced to go into a program they don't think they want or need. They go though the motions and are released. Really effective huh?
Chris Brown doesn't remember, and gets WOWed when he sees the damage he did. That is NOT him, and mom states pretty much that she agrees with that.
Sorry. You don't just wake up one day and snap like that! He doesn't remember should trigger some to action, but if you read around? Its a joke, and people don't take that to serious.
Some people feel he is full of it, or saving his behind! People don't think of the implications if that is true. Its like he blacked out while drunk. Personally? It makes sense to me in some ways. I don't know if it is mentally blocked out due to can't deal with it or what. Do I think they can't recall all of it? I don't buy that part either.
Another portion of that is he doesn't want to remember or deal with his actions.
Its easier on his anxiety level to not go there at all.
He needs to! You will notice that abusers tend NOT to go there 100%. They do know their actions are unacceptable, but they also have spent a lifetime honing their skills to get you off the subject as well.
Its part of their dance, and sadly most people fall into that hole with them.
THEY GO TO COURT WITHOUT COOPERATION OF VICTIM
I think again this is where the support system comes into place. He is either playing prince charming or the raging monster...and your support system is crumbling before you eyes.
Victims get scared and will return and drop the charges. The abusers get their fix back only to abuse yet another day. Laws changed due to this dynamic that the police and justice system saw, but others tend to ignore.
Chris Brown and Rhianna have it a bit different than most. Am I saying chances are she didn't hear alot of ignorant comments from her 'supporters'? No.
Its also clear Chris's mother likes to think this happened out of no where as well.
They do have the extra pressure of their fame, their reputations and the supporters reputations, etc that helped keep them stay apart in alot of ways.
I have to wonder if either truly got the help they are going to need to break this cycle in their lifes.
The forced separation doesn't stop inner dynamics within the person.
If she doesn't get help to learn that she is a person of worth? If she can't own that she shouldn't be treated like this?
It will happen again within her lifetime. If not in an intimidate relationship? It will be within a career, friendship, family member, etc.
You see this is learned behavior within her! It didn't just 'appear' one day either.
SHOULD HE SPEAK ABOUT HIS ACTIONS?
At this point in his life? He is not capable of it. If he truly heals himself? He could be a huge asset for people to understand domestic violence.
Why does he do that? Why does she stay?
Both those different dynamics could be answered if he takes those healing steps, and allows himself to be upfront and honest. He could be a huge stepping stone towards people understanding. People will realize we need to approach abusive relationships differently.
YES it would help if she did the same! You see that portion in stories you read, but you don't hear to many abusers TALKING IT UP do you?
I think abusive situations are not dealt with because of denial. Its not just denial on the parts of the victims or abusers. Its denial with supportive systems, lawyers, parents, clergy as well.
What would happen if he could openly show you how he manipulated the situation to fit his own needs?
That is part of the cycle that most don't like to see. I think its pride most of all. No one likes to admit they were snowed.
They have to remember this person took a lifetime to learn those skills, and make them effortless. They had alot of practice, and at this point? They are a PRO!
We all have had people that took advantage of us, and at times its hard to admit.
We need to learn to admit it if we are going to learn HOW to stop the cycle from continuing.
Good support systems help in so many ways. They must be educated, and allow themselves to realize they got snowed as well.
I would bet most people that met Chris Brown felt he was a very nice and sweet man. I'm sure he can be, but they have a very hard time wrapping their minds around that evil portion.
Its an ego slap to them. Its okay to admit it, because that is what they do. If people can't see that far? We will not be a good support system.
You need to take that feeling and multiply by 1000 to realize how broken the victim is in order to help. If you were snowed and hurt - imagine how much more damaged and hurt the victims must feel.
These types of actions don't just fall out of the sky one day. This dynamic has been going on for some time on BOTH sides!
Are we going to own the fact we got snowed as well, or allow our egos to keep us in denial?
Everyone has a long hard road ahead! What a HUGE statement it would be to the world if those dynamics were reversed.
We need to realize this happens in all types of abusive relationships. I don't care if its male, female or purple people eaters! If we can't open our eyes, ears and hearts? Don't expect the dynamic to disappear.
Life just doesn't work that way.
It takes work, encouragement, support along with other things.
People have a hard time with that. They don't realize they are also part of the cycle of abuse. Their ignorance enables it to continue whether they admit it or not.
