India’s Daughter, Difficult to Change Culture

Culture is a very power thing no matter where you live.  It effects your life, and those around you as well.  Changing culture is a very hard thing to do, and people always are afraid of this change.

 

There is never anything truly WRONG with my culture, but it is YOURS that is the problem.

 

We have seen this used against a faith community due to terrorists that claim they represent the faith themselves.  So people condemn them all. 

 

We see the same thing when it comes to same type of generalizations towards race, and gender. 

 

You can condemn things easier when you have removed their humanity.  You then can view them as a group, and that makes your contempt, distain, and hate more palatable.   You can learn to live with that, because you no longer see them as human.

 

They are now just ‘them’.

 

India’s Daughter

 

I had been reading recently about an documentary on BBC about, “India’s Daughter’'.  It is a documentary on the brutal gang-rape of Jyoti Singh in 2012, and speaks of the protests and rioting in that country afterwards. 

 

They wanted to change the culture’s view towards women, and you can feel how HARD that is going to be just by listening to how some of the individuals speak about this horrific crime. 

 

Jyoti Singh is a perfect example of ‘them’ in her culture.

 

(You can try to google the documentary, but I get the impression they are removing it as fast as people can upload it online.  I found it on youtube.)

 

It’s going to be a HUGE uphill battle to change their culture, because their culture has been in place for centuries.  You are brought up from cradle to grave with what they see as acceptable viewpoints towards the female gender.

 

When Jyoti was born her family gave out candies to celebrate her birth, and people didn’t understand WHY they would do this…you only do that for boys.  Her parents told them they celebrate their children. 

 

When she was older she asked that they use her dowry to pay for her schooling, and her parents also sold their ancestral land to pay for her studies. 

 

The culture was astonished that they would throw away all that for this girl.  To her parents she was a good investment, and besides they loved her.

 

She finished her final exams to be a doctor, and she was on break until her 6 months of what we call ‘residency’ started.  She and male friend went to see a movie that night, and on their bus ride home 6 men beat her male friend…and raped, tortured and left her to die on the side of the road. 

 

A man that found her described her as a cow after giving birth.  Her organs were coming out her vagina, and he said he was frustrated because no one was helping.  They just watched.

 

Her mother said her last words were:  Sorry Mummy.  I gave you so much trouble.  I’m sorry.

 

 

At that point the machines flatlined, and her breathing stopped.

 

Jyoti was dead.  Her father’s words about her funeral?  You could feel and hear the heartbreak even though he kept his composure.  I’ll leave the description there, so you may see it for yourself in the documentary.

 

Protests for Change

 

For FAR to many in India? 

 

It was assumed that Jyoti was just one of  ‘them’.

 

Protestors wanted to change that reality for her, and for women in general in India.  They wanted to change people’s minds that she was human, and not a ‘them’. 

 

They want to give females the humanity that they deserve.

 

Like many cultures if you listen to the men (most of them anyway) in this documentary they speak of women as more precious than a gem or diamond.

 

“She should not be put on the streets just like food.  The ‘lady’, on the other hand, you can say the ‘girl’ or ‘woman’, are more precious than a gem, than a diamond.  Its up to you how you want to keep that diamond in your hand.  If you put that diamond on the street, certainly the dogs will carry it out.  You can’t stop it”   - Attorney for Rapists

 

So, in other words the ‘dogs’ (men) see women as food to carry out, because of instinct.  It can’t be stopped.  So, if you don’t show the dogs outside you have food (your women) they can’t carry it out.

 

Problem is their ‘more precious than a gem’ women also are attacked within the house by dogs, and that is also their fault.

 

India Banned The Documentary

 

Now, India is having a problem with this documentary.  They don’t wish for people to discuss the dogs, nor steps on how to stop them.  They claim that the documentary shames their women, and doesn’t represent THEIR India.

 

Let’s be honest here!  We all know its not about how this will shame women, and cause trouble for them.  They just don’t like how their patriarchy on steroids has shamed the dogs.  Their entitled to their place, and their women have theirs.

 

Like I said in the beginning – its hard to change culture.  With progress, education, and changes within their culture?  They will embrace the pride in their country once again.

 

In the meantime?  They better hold on to their hats, because ‘banning’ the film is just causing people to seek it out even more to see it anyway.  They basically gave the film FREE publicity that they were not counting on.

 

I pray that their ‘gems’ receive their humanity back, because no one deserves to be a ‘them’.

 

Additional Resources:

'India's Daughter,' the film banned by India: What did it show?

Indian government remains defiant over ban on BBC rape documentary

Indian Lawyers May Be Reprimanded for Sexist Remarks in Rape Documentary

Alicia Gray Detachment From Reality

I watched a video of Alicia Gray, a former high school teacher in Mobile, Alabama that was sentenced to jail for Child Rape.

I’m not going to call it a ‘inappropriate relationship’ to make it more palatable for others, but I will call it what it is.

It was a crime of rape against a child of 14 years, and she will have to register as a sexual offender for the rest of her life once she is released from prison.


I realize some feel that direct approach is harsh. Hardly. That’s like saying someone that got caught stealing was borrowing with no intent of giving the item back.  “Borrowing’ isn’t the proper word, and nor is ‘relationship’ in the context you have used.  Its minimizing the crime she is attempting to address.  Ownership is part of this.

Someone (the child) in this circumstance was given a life sentence, and it does no good for anyone to make that reality palatable for others and the criminal.  Her poor husband and child also have a great deal of hurt, and a life sentence as well.

Christian’s being direct about certain sins, and sugar coating others?  It just doesn’t give you the appearance you claim you stand for.  There is no show of firmness when you waffle back and forth like that.  Think about it!

Caught on tape: 5 self-serving responses by sex offenders in the church – Recommended reading

Sinister or Naïve

I have to be honest I don’t know much about Alicia Gray’s church, but what I have found is some churches its plain to see their sinister side. I don’t think that label applies here.

The Tina Anderson story, and CJ Mahaney story are more along the lines of what I feel is sinister. They know the game, and are playing it for their audience well.

I see a more naïve side from this group, and lack of the understanding of the dynamics of the crime involved. To be more specific the dynamics of this type of criminal.

The second group allows themselves this spiritual naïve nature to often at the expense of others. It may not be their intention, but they allow their good nature to override their common sense.

They spiritualize things instead of directly confronting them.  God doesn’t ask us to distance ourselves from our crime, and tell others my OLD person did that in the fashion they presented this.  You see detachment, and not ownership in a healthy fashion.

I honestly don’t have a problem with this church ‘supporting them’ as the pastor mentioned. Jesus would have us support criminals as much as victims. Yet, they so clearly didn’t understand the harm they were doing, and I’m sure still feel they did a good thing in releasing this video.  They wanted to show the world they were showing Grace to her, and yet Grace is not suppose to be at the expense of others.

Here is a quote from the pastor,

"The purpose of the video was simply to say to everybody, there is hope for you. If you have failed, if you have failed God, if you have fallen further than you ever thought you could, the love, grace and healing of God will be able to forgive you," Wyatt, who leads Deeper Life Fellowship in Mobile, Ala., told The Christian Post on Wednesday.

Alicia Gray never mentioned how she had fallen further than she never felt she could – or even went near that in this message.  She excused herself by stating she did this because of insecurity, and a void that was left because Jesus wasn’t in her life.  Yes, among other things.

Honestly?  Grace should have shown a humble and contrite person who fully acknowledges the harm they have done to others.  It would think about the impact this statement from her would have towards her  victim and his family:

Because of that joy he has given me, and the changed identity I no longer have to feel shame about the person I once was.  And I will never be again, and because I know who I am in Jesus.

When you are given grace from God, and FEEL it in your heart, soul and life?  You want to give this sense of grace to others, and not tell a hurting family that you harmed that you have no shame because of some faith transformation.  Discernment was completely absent here.  She admits later on she hasn’t even truly began to feel the brunt of the harm she did either – we will see that later on.

The way she presented this message is she pretty much has detached herself from her crime in a unhealthy fashion, because she truly doesn’t feel the harm she has caused.  I mean the ‘old’ person did that – not the new ME!  Yes, you can show ownership of this crime…and God’s presence can still be there firmly in your heart.   Do they feel Grace can’t be present under those circumstances, or are they in a rush to wash the sin off them? 

That’s the feeling most get – her rush to wash this sin off her.  She used the transformation to distance herself from having to deal with it, and sadly you have to wonder does she realize her uphill battle has just begun?  She has built herself up SO HIGH will she be able to handle things when the down hill parts come?

Sadly, from what I have seen in life?  They get very upset that others don’t accept this ‘new’ person, and still treat them like the old one.  The true test will be after the harsh realities of prison life, and how this crime will impact her from then on.  The detachment I see today won’t work as well later on.  It won’t properly process the harm she has done to her husband and baby.  It won’t understand WHY she will have problems finding a job.  How will she handle things when people question her presence alone with her baby.

You don’t see that preparation in this video at all.  Do they think this is not needed?  That this isn’t part of it?

The Merit Badge of Being A Christian

Some use the label Christian, or their relationship with the criminal as a merit badge that the criminal will have this air of honesty, integrity and character as they walk with them during this crisis.
It’s almost like since they have our merit badge its okay to assume they will deal with us in honestly and truth. It doesn’t matter that their crimes tend to call that into question. You have to wonder if they feel they can’t serve them properly unless they use this naïve mindset.  They also are refusing to face this detachment you can clearly see in her performance.

At this point common sense leaves the building, and we enter the time and space of the spiritual la la land. You witness and hear all the correct keywords and phrases that make Christian’s swoon with joy as the criminal plays it for them.

YES her character and integrity can be called into question due to her crimes. A person that is truly contrite in their repentance isn’t going to get defensive about that. They expect it.

If you read her transcript instead of listening to it with the music, emotion, and watching her smile at her transformation?  Its not the same, because you can clearly catch things that don’t make sense while looking at the words – and not just watching her speak them.

Acknowledging the Dynamics of a Criminal

There are different characteristics of criminals depending on their crime. There are similar characteristics as well for most.

Criminals like Alicia Gray use manipulation to draw her victim in, and they are con artists. Those aspects of their personality didn’t just appear one day, and disappear the next. They couldn’t hook their victims in if they were not GOOD at it. Being good at something takes time and experience.

Now, when you point those ‘realities’ out to some individuals? They tend to do the very thing they accuse the ‘world’ of doing…assume the worse. They state in reference to the convicted criminal, “I hear you saying that there is no hope for a perpetrator!”

Actually, no one is saying that.

Sure, the criminal DID say all the right things! Remember their merit badge. They used their keywords, and phrases…and maybe even wailed in response when they reminded the criminal that God forgives …and loves them.

No one is saying to not do what you feel convicted to do, but do it in a wise way.  In this case admit she wasn’t speaking of Grace that your church showed her, and the place she found herself in.   Remember your purpose of the video?  She didn’t even mention anything regarding that purpose.  She was too busy sailing around with the Jesus Language.

I mean she didn’t even mention how God is going to help her with her struggles in the days forward, and to me that a huge portion to leave out.

She concentrated mostly on the transformation, and then shamed the victim by telling them she hopes they get over the bitterness, and sadly does NOT show she understands the implications of her actions.  

I don't expect that the forgiveness might happen.  I understand the implications of pain and bitterness that I have caused.  Your completely justified to feel that way, but I do pray that each of you be free of the pain and bitterness, anger, anxiety or whatever you feel.  Those are not things that are from God.  God does not want that for you.  He didn't want the situation to happen, but Thank God he uses the hurts of others. He redeemed me.  And he placed it in my heart to just glorify him.   And I pray that he uses this situation to heal all those involved. 

What victim in their right mind wants to her their abuser say that God used the harm that was done to them to redeem their abuser?  How their righteous anger is not of God?  How the abuser is all better now, and I hope you get there too! 

Your keywords and phases are there, but they make NO SENSE under the circumstances!  Its selfish really.

She may have acknowledged the entire REALM of what she did within the presence of her husband, your church, your counselors or whomever.  Although I have to be honest – I doubt it.  Sadly, if she wished to show the Grace she claims God has shown her?  She also would had to have felt the entire impact of what she has done.  She didn’t do that she admits, and then tells people it would be a performance for them if she did.

Its one of those things that peace and rest, which are thrown around alot but...God really gives us overwhelming peace when you know who you are, and you don't have to do something to make God happy with you.   You don't have to perform for other people, because I have had a lot of advice from people:  that they need to see me cry more, and people need to see me fall apart.  And my body makes me think, 'Shouldn't I be a mess right now?  Shouldn't I have to do this?  But God just lets that peace fall, and gives me that security of knowing that I'm just not that person anymore!

Seriously?  She doesn’t have to fall apart knowing what she did, and then allow God to lift her back up again?  She bypasses that all together, and then tries to tell people she understands the implications.  Where does that happen in your bible, because it doesn’t happen in mine!

I just can’t picture Nathan letting David get away with that can you?

Sadly, people get to carried away with this ‘instant’ glorification of being transformed…and don’t realize they get played more than they are willing to admit.

Time, words and actions show the truth!   Time with Action was overlooked here. Pride is holding you back from acknowledging this.  You got caught up in the emotion of it, but time will show us if it is truly real.

Christians are quick to bring up stories they have seen or heard of this INSTANT transformation, and they refuse to face the fact we are all human. It doesn’t happen as often as they want to believe it does.  It also doesn’t change the reality here.  It just shows how willing they are to quickly go into some naïve mindset.

All Christians are in a constant state of repentance after all. All transformations take time, because breaking habits is never easy for anyone. I mean remember someone in your life that has something SMALL they are fighting to overcome…like biting their fingernails! This is MUCH bigger than that. Why is it people think the dangerous stuff is easier to overcome if they put on the proper show for others?

Keep in mind what she did was more than a bad habit, and she will need intense therapy for some time.  She didn’t even acknowledge that, because her old person is gone……Wow.

A Truly Repentant Person Naturally is Contrite

A person that is truly repentant isn’t going to resist all the extras that are required from them, and at times I feel some Christians feel it maybe TOO much for them to handle…and they may flee.

Sadly, that is a sign they are not ready to do what you are wanting from them. You need to figure out a new approach. If you refuse to face this fact? You want a fantasyland, and not the biblical turning you claim you are for.

They shouldn’t resist holding their feet to the fire, because they need it! God wants it! Remember those speeches they gave you, because they told you they wanted it too! If they keep running sometimes prayer is the only thing you can offer.

Choosing to Believe Survivors Or Criminals

Lastly, to those people that are all ready to hand her over your faith in her repentance need to listen to those that have gone down this road before.

You tend to downplay, minimize, and make excuses for why you refuse to take their counsel. You assume the worse – they have been hurt, and are marinating it…so what do they know.

Granted some people are marinating in their hurt, and I don’t deny that. You might be surprised at how many have moved beyond that, and want to save you the pain of what they have learned and experienced. Instead, you treat them like a perpetual wounded animal that just wants to bite you. 

So your okay with taking the word of a person that has bitten others, and willingly ignore the ones that got bit.  Why does this make sense to you?  Honestly, that never made a lick of sense to me!

Think for a moment! You are willing to give your all to someone that has shown they are able to harm others, but you aren’t willing to listen to the ones that have survived this crisis.  That lacks common sense when you distance yourself enough to look at it clearly.

Much to often I see people telling experienced survivors they are speaking from hurt, and that hurt has jaded their outlook. They never consider they themselves are being naïve, and in some ways very arrogant. Instead of dismissing them try listening.

What is it going to hurt? Open your mind and heart as you have with the criminal. Can they NOT be authentic too? Do they not have the right to the same respect? It may give you ideas of how to better approach the next crisis, and actually stop the games that criminals tend to play almost by their very nature.  Sadly, this game is VERY easy to play within the Christian environment.

Sure, criminals will admit certain things at times. They will speak of their struggle, and if you use too much wishful thinking instead of wisdom? They are going to play you like a concert pianist! Some aspects maybe on the purpose, and other aspects are just plain old habits that are hard to break. It is what it is.

Victims that are overlooked

Regarding the church in question? I think they were caught up with showing the world how they offered grace to Alicia Gray. Alicia spent much of the time proselytizing, and her apology was too generic.
Her journey is too premature to have experienced this turn yet. It’s going to be a life long journey for her, and she has some HUGE hills to climb in the future. I do pray she walks the walk as well she talked the talk.

Sadly, this church was so caught up with doing what they felt was right that they missed aspects that no doubt hurt the victim and his family.  I also think they are having a hard time admitting that, and just think their introduction – or purpose – of the video could have been done better.  I mean they didn’t even realize Alicia didn’t even address the question at the beginning of the video, nor the purpose of it that the pastor mentioned.

I think their hearts were in the right place, but they completely missed was really needed. I don’t fault them for supporting a criminal. I do hope they yearn to understand why so many felt their production they made in good faith was so triggering, and tragic to so many others that walked down that path before they did.

Side note from me!
I saw the news casts of her walking into court with her husband. That poor man had agony dripping from his pores, and he needs support completely and absolutely distanced from what you feel his wife needs. Separate from the marriage vows. It should be all about him – the poor man needs it.   He needs more than your keywords, and Christian phrases…that they have sadly turned into more of platitudes at this point.   He has a child to consider as well.

Besides the victim and his family? That husband broke my heart just watching him. Learn about the dynamics of the circumstances you are dealing with, and give him the fruitful grace he needs.  I wouldn’t do another video about it.  No doubt he has enough to deal with.  Guilt by association by people, etc. 

I can understand her NOT mentioning him in her court statement, but she didn’t even give him one syllable in the video either. That’s downright hurtful from my viewpoint – no show of grace regarding his support? Yet another HUGE aspect your good intentions completely missed.

Additional Resources:
IT wasn’t a relationship! By Watch Keep – Amy Smith
Being Married to a Pedophile: A Wife Speaks Out and Offers Hope to Other Wives of Pedophiles
Remorse, Repentance, Recovery

Transcript of Alicia Gray Video

Below is a transcript from Alicia Gray that came from a video that you can find on Youtube.  This is part one only.

Alicia Gray Video Part One

Pastor Mark Wyatt Introduction:

Hey everybody as you know umm about 11 months ago last February we got word at Deeper Life that one of our church members Alicia Gray had been arrested and charged with umm a sexual relationship with one of her students. 

She is a high school teacher here in Mobile.  And we decided then and there that the degree of her guilt and innocence would not be a deciding factor on how we loved her and how much we loved her.  So we decided the rally around them. And we knew that was the right thing to do, and so over the last 11 months its been an amazing thing to watch as Alicia has had her identity redefined in the context of the fact she is the daughter of God.  That she is fully loved no matter what she does.

In talking with Alicia's Lawyer - Chris and Alicia decided a few months ago to a plea deal.  So they agree to plead out umm for time for her.  And so this morning umm a sentence was handed down.  And a number of us were able to be there at the court room for her to be there for sentencing. 

And in that moment Alicia got to make a statement to the judge before he sentenced her that honestly I have to tell you that was one of the most powerful things I have ever heard in my life. 

Alicia's statement preached the gospel,  It showed the power of grace and how grace has saved her.  And the love of the father has saved her life.

In that statement she apologized to the young man involved in that relationship, and his family.  And she talked about what she wants to see the Lord do there. So after the sentencing umm I was able to sit down with Alicia and get an interview with her on video.  We had talked about this beforehand.  She wanted to do this.  and   We want you to hear Alicia's heart.  We want you to hear what God has done in her life in the last 11 months.

Here is Alicia Gray.


(1:52 minute Mark in Video)

What is the difference between regret and shame?

(Question presented at the beginning of video)


Hmm.  I actually just explained that to some of my in-laws on the way here.
Umm This is something...

So of course I'm very sorry for my selfish actions, and the choices that I made out of insecurity and hurts that I felt myself.  Umm And I'm sorry for those, and I'm thankful that God has changed me and shown me my identity in Jesus Christ where I don't make those same selfish decisions and hurt other people. 

umm So because of that joy he has given me, and the changed identity I no longer have to feel shame about the person I once was.  And I will never be again, and because I know who I am in Jesus.

Its one of those things of peace and rest, which are words we thrown around alot but...God really gives us overwhelming peace when you know who you are, and you don't have to do something to make God happy at you.  

You don't have to perform for other people, and ahh because I have had alot of advice throughout this:  that they need to see me cry more, and people need to see me fall apart.  And my body sometimes makes me think, 'Shouldn't I be a mess right now?  Shouldn't I have to do this?  But God just lets that peace fall, and gives me that security of knowing that I'm just not that person anymore!

And I don't have to live the way I used to live, because it was different, but I had DID.  I had insecurities.  I umm I had pain in my own heart, and a void I thought I needed to fill. 

Though attention and all kinds of other things.  And that void was just needing Jesus.  And having absolutely  no lack, and that he completely fills everything and makes me secure in whom I am.  Happy in whom I am.  and makes it where he is the only person I want to please .  The great thing is I don't have to do anything to please him.  Because when God sees me he just sees Jesus... and Jesus absolute finished work on the cross, and he is very happy of me.

The statement I made in court today, and I would like to everyone to didn't hear in fullness:

I just want to say this in regards to the victim, and the family...and anyone that has been hurt though this:  I wanted to apologize for my inappropriate, and selfish and very hurtful actions.

Selfish really is the word.  I acted out on my own though my own insecurities without thoughtful concern for anyone else's well being.

I realize I have hurt many people, and I've also realized the implications of what I've done. 

And the possible difficulties that can cause for people who have been hurt:  Bitterness, angry, fear, anxiety, depression and insecurity...and so on, and all those things we think those things that led up to my behaviors.  And I don't wish that on anyone else. 

Umm Complete healing is needed for you to be able to walk in and umm in complete grace that God gives. 
And I apologize for what I have done, and that person from a year ago is gone, and has changed forever thanks to the grace and mercy of Jesus Christ.  And God our father and the renewed mind that he has given me. 

Everyone that has been hurt is constantly in my prayers, and I pray that my unwarranted actions and the hurt it has caused don't have a hold on anyone's life's.  I pray for peace, healing and restoration. 

And my ultimate prayer is you kingdom come, and your will be done God. 

Take this situation and that should have never ever happened, and provide healing and rest in the ones that have been hurt. 

Um Jesus has brought me to a place of peace in which I'm ready for the consequences that should befall me.
 
He showed me the continued difficulty that people would experience should this case go to trial. so, I have no desire to drag anyone through that.  Or require people that have been hurt to have to testify publicly, or hear the testimonies.   

Thankfully God presented another option which I can confess my actions alone without requiring others to have anyone have to endure that.  I confess my sin, and I ask forgiveness whom each person involved.   Anyone that has been hurt or touched by this.  Whether small or big is all the same.  Hurt is hurt. 

I don't expect that the forgiveness might happen.  I understand the implications of pain and bitterness that I have caused.  Your completely justified to feel that way, but I do pray that each of you be free of the pain and bitterness, anger, anxiety or whatever you feel.  Those are not things that are from God.  God does not want that for you.  He didn't want the situation to happen, but Thank God he uses the hurts of others. He redeemed me.  And he placed it in my heart to just glorify him.   And I pray that he uses this situation to heal all those involved. 

God is the business of loving people and restoring lives.  Nothing compares to his great love.

There are several people that have been victim to this situation.    All those that have been hurt.  It should have never happened to you, but God still makes beauty from ashes.  He can restore your life’s that are broken, and because I chose to act out of selfishness and hurt... people.  I continue to pray that the healer of all healers can give you freedom from the pain you have experienced.  I will ask my friends, family, and church congregation to keep you in prayer for complete healing, peace and restoration.   Grace and peace be with you. 

Crime Versus Sin–Does Paige Patterson know the difference?

There's no room in the church for whistleblowers – Paige Patterson

Paige Patterson started his sermon with 1 Corinthians 6.  His main message was that you and I do not bring sin of the church out into the open so the media – or law enforcement – might judge it. 

His message is called, So You Believe in the inerrancy of God’s word…well Bully for YOU!

Inerrancy, simplistically is basically the bible is accurate and completely free from error.  I linked to a urban dictionary so you can see what is meant by Bully for YOU.  I think in this case it’s basically saying GOOD for you with sarcasm.

Paige then goes into a lesson about why you should bring matters to the church, and not the media and as he also stated….law enforcement. 

Funny thing is if humans in history had followed this belief system that even if the church is wrong?  You need to ROLL with it?  No one would have broke off from the main church back in history, and we wouldn’t have different denominations today. 

All the theologians we like to read about, or love to death?  For example, Luther, Calvin, Wesley and many others?  They would be non existent, and we would still be under the rule of a cruel religious system.

Remember the history that when individuals tried to take things to the church the church ran right over them.  They tortured people, and killed them.  This was ‘church business’, and they shut you down with the threat of their power.

Sadly, it seems the church trying a different tactic.  They can’t use the torture method of the past, but they will use lies and propaganda instead.

History is repeating itself, and the means maybe different….yet the message is the same.

No matter what ….. keep it in the church!

Morality of Knowing the difference between Sin and Crime

To me it seems these church leaders with all their education, study, and knowledge still don’t seem to grasp the difference between CRIME and SIN.  I’m speaking more on a morality principal here.  Crime is sin of course, but not every sin is crime as in police involvement, etc.

People LOVE to use the sexual abuse cover-up of the Catholic church against them for a host of reasons, and that circumstance does show they also didn’t view crime and sin properly at that time. 

The Catholic hierarchy had the notion that child rape was a sin rather than a crime. Hence the emphasis on forgiveness, therapy, repentance - rather than removal, prosecution and investigation. Obviously, there's one reason for this: they were defending the reputation of the church by hiding its darkest secrets, and they were using the authority of religion to do so.

Faith organizations outside the Catholic Church do this as well, and they see it as somewhat different FOR THEM.  I guess they feel they can do it ‘better’ or something.  Yet, in most cases they do this for the same reasons:  hiding its darkest secrets, and they are using the authority of religion to do so.

Now, I think we all realize there are certain circumstances that can be dealt with in the church.  It’s the same with the personnel issues with the staff.  Not every single item needs to be out in the open.  Its better to handle gossip about members, or personnel issues like tardiness within the church.  When aspects grow beyond the garden variety sins?  They can be crimes, and no where in the bible will you find that we are NOT to take that to police. 

Paige Patterson missed one KEY word in scripture he presented.  That word ‘trivial’.  How he could have missed it?

Trivial Matter or Not so Trivial…that is the question!

What would take for YOU to sue this institution if you worked for it? Paige Patterson asked an attorney that was applying for a job there – around 3:20 mark.  The attorney stated it would have to be a circumstance in which his rights were seriously abused, and he was asked to give some examples. 

Patterson asked him if those circumstances were in the bible, and the attorney stated he did not believe so.  To which Paige Patterson giggled that he was NOT in the employment of this organization.  To Paige this is common, because we live in a world of accusations.

Now my first thought was an attorney working with Paige Patterson isn’t going to bring a lawsuit against the organization over ‘accusations’.  I mean lawyers realize you need more than that to do anything about it. 

We also need to remember that in the past the church had the power to take the law into their own hands, and hand down punishment, judgment, etc. The church today can’t send someone to the RACK, or cut out their tongue and all those torture techniques anymore.  WELL at least in most countries today.

You do find in most cases when an individual or groups of individuals bring the court or the media to the attention of the church?  Its habitual criminal or unethical behavior.

We aren’t speaking of just plain sin here, but crime!

² Or do you not know that the saints will judge the world? And if the world is to be judged by you, are you incompetent to try trivial cases? ³ Do you not know that we are to judge angels?

Now you notice in the above the scripture mentions ‘trivial’ cases.  Rape is not trivial, and child rape is certainly not either.  The habitual covering up abuse cases isn’t trivial.  Its not only sin, but a crime. 

Folks if you are going to judge angels, and if you are going to judge the world don’t you think you can handle the same problems that happen in the Church of God?  - Paige Patterson

⁵ I say this to your shame. Can it be that there is no one among you wise enough to settle a dispute between the brothers, ⁶ but brother goes to law against brother, and that before unbelievers? ⁷ To have lawsuits at all with one another is already a defeat for you. Why not rather suffer wrong? Why not rather be defrauded?

Next, Paige goes into hinting at circumstances are well beyond what you would consider ‘trivial’ cases.  This is where they attempt to melt the trivial with the not trivial issues. 

Its where the church gets themselves into trouble, because they do have a moral obligation to report crime!   See below:

1 Peter 2:13 Submit yourselves for the Lord’s sake to every authority instituted among men: whether to the king, as the supreme authority, (14) or to governors, who are sent by him to punish those who do wrong and to commend those who do right.

Yet, they feel their reputation would be stained.  How little faith is my first thought.  Sure, you may struggle because of the crime for a period.  God will bless you for doing what is right, and his will – NOT OURS – be done!

I offer a different scripture that speaks to the spirit of the discussion:

1 Timothy 1:8 We know that the law is good if one uses it properly.
(9) We also know that the law is not made for the righteous but for the law breakers and rebels, the ungodly and sinful, the unholy and irreligious; for those who kill their fathers or mothers, for murderers,
(10) for adulterers and perverts, for slave traders and liars and perjurers - and for whatever is contrary to the sound doctrine
(11) that conforms to the glorious gospel of the blessed God, which he entrusted to me.

Accept Injustices because God told you TOO!

Paige Patterson states that people just want to go to the law, because they feel that the church FAILED them in the judgment process.   They don’t feel justice has been served.

Why don’t you learn to just accept WRONG!  Learn to accept INjustice!  You say its no in my basic makeup to do that!  You know I’m an Irish Texan so lets FIGHT!   (giggles from audience)  But is what God’s word demands.  Why is that? Why would God say, “Why don’t you just accept wrong?”  Why would he ask you to do that?  WELL that all depends on your viewpoint of God!   If in your mind and heart God is a JUST GOD that settles the issue Folks!

What that means is God eventually sets everything right.  If you are wronged?  Somewhere down the line God sets it right!  Well you say, “Well he is to slow!” NOOO!  He is right on time.  When it needs to happen he will set it right.  Than you say, “ I’m dying and he still hasn’t set it right!”  No one said he will could set it right in this life! – Paige Patterson

What Paige needs to think about is if God feels there is sin in the church that needs to come into the light?  He also will use his means to do it, and yes today that could very well be the media and the police. 

No doubt the church may get it wrong from time to time on trivial matters.  Yet, when its not the trivial matters and God is using the media or police?  You also need to accept God’s decision. 

Sadly, Paige Patterson seems to feel you are sinning against the church instead.  The ‘crime’ against him is more important than the crime against society.  No human is that important.

Again there is a BIG difference between SIN and CRIME!  In the bible we read about punishments that people had to endure because of the crimes they committed, and the church sanctioned those punishments.    The bible is full of stories of how people were punished for crimes during that period of history (Exodus has plenty of examples), and how many struggled with their sin (David, for example).

We also have examples later on in church history where the church used its powers to commit injustices….because they had the power to do so.    That’s where the breaks from the church started, and the injustices of the church were the reason.

If what he states is true?  We would only have ONE church, and not all these different denominations.  Chances are Paige would NOT be in his position at the Seminary, because we may still be under rule of the Catholic Church.

Paige also feels people to just accept things as the people in leadership tell you to, and if its not right God will handle them.  You may not see justice, but God will handle that in his own time.  He may not show you his justice, because chances are you would ‘gloat’ about it anyway.  He seems to feel that justice – that you could see -  may damage your walk in faith. 

Yes, he lays it on THICK doesn’t he?

You don’t take matters to the PRESS!

Paige Patterson next decided he would play God, and mention he will ‘expand’ on this scripture of 1 Corinthians 6.   You don’t take matters to the media!

“If I had fifty dollars for every time that I have told somebody from the press: ‘I’m not going to comment on that because, frankly, it’s none of your business; it’s the church of God’ — if I had fifty dollars for every time I’ve done that, this would be a wealthy institution and you wouldn’t have to pay any tuition at all,” he said.
“I’m not going to talk to the press about things that are matters internal to the church of the Living God,” Patterson said. “It is none of their business. And they can’t possibly get it right, and they don’t get it right, so why do you take it to the world of unbelief? Whether that be the court, whether that be the press? ‘Well there’s just no other way to handle it.’ Yes there is. Commit it to the Lord God Almighty.”

Church history shows that the church doesn’t always get things right, and people have gone OUTSIDE the church….or tore off a piece to make a new church due to what Paige feel is ‘matters internal to the church of the living God’.

If we take this stern approach?  All other denominations have their foundation firmly planted in SIN!  How does he live with that reality?  He doesn’t, and no doubt would think that concept is a joke.  Yet, that would mean at times it is OKAY to go outside the church with matter beyond ‘trivial’.  Yes?

⁹ Or do you not know that the unrighteous^[b] will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived: neither the sexually immoral, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor men who practise homosexuality,^{[c] 10} nor thieves, nor the greedy, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor swindlers will inherit the kingdom of God. ¹¹ And such were some of you. But you were washed, you were sanctified, you were justified in the name of the Lord Jesus Christ and by the Spirit of our God.

…and IF you suffer for it. and IF you were misused! And IF you were abused, and if you are not represented properly!  Its Okay.  You can trust it (pointing up) to God who judges justly.  May God grant that we do that. – Paige Patterson

Then he finishes with a prayer:

…That we won’t take our troubles to the press.  That we won’t take out troubles to the government. That we won’t take our troubles anywhere except to the people of God, and beyond that to the Lord Jesus.  And may we as a result present to the Lord Jesus upon his return  a beautifully adorned Bride – the bride of Christ – Holy and Pure upon him.  In Jesus name we pray.  Amen.

When Pastor’s manipulate scripture in this manner their integrity comes into question.   They pretend there is no difference between sin and crime.  They do this to protect themselves, and they feel the reputation of the church.  God doesn’t need their protection, because he is MORE than capable of taking care of it himself.

Let’s be honest with ourselves here!  Paige Patterson is more concerned with HIS reputation, and his post of power.  If he isn’t doing anything immoral or illegal?  He doesn’t need to tell the press that church business its none of their business when they come to him with questions about his conduct.  He should have nothing to hide.  If he is doing nothing wrong?  He should have enough faith to know that God will protect him, and hand out justice as he sees fit.

Cindy Kunsman today wrote an article about Hana Williams today.  The Christian parents that beat her, and starved her to death were sentenced in court this week for their punishment.  The father got 27 years, and the mother received 37 years.  Their actions were sin of course, but thankfully people knew their was also a crime that needed punishment for the good of society.

Yes, it was okay to take those troubles to the court.  There was nothing sinful about it.

When will we – the Body of Christ – demand our teachers of the church use discernment to know the difference between ‘trivial’ sins and crimes against society?  Paige Patterson’s lesson shows clearly how they don’t have a clue.

So You Believe in the inerrancy of God’s word …..Well Bully for YOU! just remember the word ‘trivial’ is there!

Exodus 23:1 Do not spread false reports. Do not help a wicked man by being a false witness.
(2) Do not follow the crowd in doing wrong. When you give testimony in a lawsuit, do not pervert justice by siding with the crowd,
(3) and do not show favoritism to a poor man in his lawsuit.
(4) If you come across your enemy’s ox or donkey wandering off, be sure to take it back to him.
(5) If you see the donkey of someone who hates you fallen down under its load, do not leave it there; be sure you help him with it.
(6) Do not deny justice to your poor people in their lawsuits.
(7) Have nothing to do with a false charge and do not put an innocent or honest person to death, for I will not acquit the guilty.
(8) Do not accept a bribe, for a bribe blinds those who see and twists the words of the righteous.
(9) Do not oppress an alien; you yourselves know how it feels to be aliens, because you where aliens in Egypt.

Additional Reading:

Why Paige Patterson's anti-outsider stance is wrong
And what about Patterson’s insistence that his anti-outsider stance is somehow biblical? If Patterson needs a biblical basis for doing what's right, then he should look to the first thing listed by the prophet Micah. “And what does God require of you? To act justly . . . .” (Micah 6:8)
Advocate says SBC leader gives bad advice
He said if law enforcement does not or cannot act to protect children “whistleblowers in churches should call journalists.”
“More wrongdoing in churches needs to be reported more often to more people who are more apt to stop it and prevent future wrongdoing,” Clohessy said.
“We hope every Baptist rejects this self-serving, unhealthy and often dangerous advice, especially when it comes to sexual and financial crimes, whether known or suspected,” he said.

Paige Patterson (SBC) Advice to Victims of Domestic Violence
Audio of Patterson telling the abuse victim to go home and pray for her spouse.
“I had a woman who was in a church that I served, and she was being subject to some abuse, and I told her, I said, “All right, what I want you to do is, every evening I want you to get down by your bed just as he goes to sleep, get down by the bed, and when you think he’s just about asleep, you just pray and ask God to intervene, not out loud, quietly,” but I said, “You just pray there.”  And I said, “Get ready because he may get a little more violent, you know, when he discovers this.”  And sure enough, he did.  She came to church one morning with both eyes black.  And she was angry at me and at God and the world, for that matter.  And she said, “I hope you’re happy.”  And I said, “Yes ma’am, I am.”  And I said, “I’m sorry about that, but I’m very happy."

People need hope. Not an English Comprehension Lesson.

It is these pearls that I encounter each time I dive below, into the dark and lonely cesspools of Christendom.  They’ve been left for dead by much of the Church, yet they are the first to expend of themselves in pursuing and loving other hurting souls.  Their own cries have been ignored, but they’re the first to listen to the cries of those around them.  Though the commitment of the Church to abuse survivors is often self-centered and short-lived, the commitment these survivors demonstrate to each other is usually selfless and lifelong.   - Boz Tchividjian

Joe Carter is one of the newer employee’s of the Gospel Coalition. He recently wrote an article that is leaving a bad taste in many mouths (Figure of speech Joe – Wink! Wink!).
It starts by:

For years it was merely an overused rhetorical trope, a hyperbolic claim that
followed a predictable pattern:

Step 1: Take an issue of concern for Christians (e.g., abortion, sex trafficking, global persecution, the gospel).

Step 2: Claim that no one in our churches is talking about the issue.
Step 3: Assume the dual role of educator and Old Testament prophet by explaining why the issue matters and why the church must stand up and speak out about it.

 
I read Boz’s opinion of victims speaking out about injustices they see in the church, and then Joe Carter shows the clear attitude they tend to be faced with presently. There is no hope there – something they clearly need – and he wants people to have a comprehension lesson for English.
 
It breaks your heart. One wishes to try to reach people where they are, and the other feels it’s a fun game to mock them into silence.
 
His technique is familiar to me! We have seen such pettiness before.   Remember this article?

Should we be saying, “The Church Hurt Me”?  Let’s review the logic they were attempting to ‘teach’ you with this article:

The person could mean the big-C Church has hurt them–all Christians everywhere. That sounds ridiculous, doesn’t it? But think about it. When a person says “The church has hurt me” and they’re refusing to visit or join any local congregation of believers they have practically projected their hurt onto the entire universal body of Christ! They have assigned their offense to every possible Christian and Christian congregation imaginable. Practically, their distrust has reached universal proportions. In every case this is false. We might provide some of our best care by helping our friends recognize the practical universalism in some of their reactions. Hopefully we can get them to dial it down to the next possible level.

 
Can we say this is a TAD bit over the TOP? They may provide their best care recognizing a common form of speech isn’t to be taken so literally.   Talking down to a hurting person isn’t going to help your case.  You do want to reach them right?
 
This form of ‘emotional’ dribble maybe taken as mocking them, and you won’t get to far.
 
Let’s imagine a young person coming to them for counsel, because they were abused in the past in the church. Empathy, and a listening ear should come first.

Sadly, it seems being petty about the phrase they used would be given first. Do they really expect this person to trust them, or even truly finish what they have to say after that? Can we use a bit of common sense for goodness sakes!
 
Well it seems that Joe Carter decided to take the same route, and ignored the context – and then took it a tab bit over top once again.
 
Janet Mefferd Quoted the issue in a nutshell:

Carter thinks that if you say, “No one in the church is talking about (an issue).”you’re “slandering Christ’s bride” because you can’t know what every individual human in every church is saying. Fine, but that’s not the sense of the term “no one” when used in that context.

 
It reminds me of a time when my son was little and I said to him,
 
“Son! Its time to go we need to put our shoes on!”
 
Son says, “These aren’t shoes MOM their Sandals!”
 
Yes, my son ignored the context of my statement. At my son’s age when this statement was made? It made sense to him that it was TRULY was a hill worth dying on!
 
Yes, he was in that kind of mood. He was going to ‘show me’ that SANDALS was the more proper way of stating my request! The fact that sandals are in fact shoes? Made no difference to him. Yes, he could be a frustrating child at times. (giggles) Thankfully, he grew out of that!
 
Now I feel I’m back in my child’s toddler years, and I’m suppose to ‘acknowledge’ since you haven’t spoke to every human in every church you can’t know that ‘no one’ is talking about some subject. Is the man freaking serious? Grow UP already!
 
Why this is so important is beyond me, because not stating it HIS way truly isn’t ‘slandering the Bride of Christ’ by any stretch of the imagination.

I can’t believe he is that ignorant that he can’t grasp the intent of those words. What can I assume? The poor man isn’t going to get to far in ministry if he can’t reach people where they are – like Jesus did.

One aspect that came up between a twitter war between Joe Carter and Janet Mefferd was about a statement that Boz said.

While comparing evangelicals to Catholics on abuse response, ”I think we are worse,” he said at the Religion Newswriters Association conference, saying too many evangelicals had “sacrificed the souls” of young victims.

My Friend – Danni Moss – Who’s blog her family left up after she passed away?  She has an article on there about the growing numbers of sexual abuse in churches.  Her source?  The churches insurance companies:

The Associated Press reported recently that three insurance companies receive upward of 260 reports each year of young people under 18 being sexually abused by Protestant clergy, challenging the assumption that clergy sexual abuse is an exclusively Catholic problem that does not take place in other churches.
That is a higher number than the annual average of 228 “credible accusations” brought against Catholic clerics in records reported by the Catholic Church in response to media scrutiny, a priest observed in a Fox News commentary questioning why the story isn’t garnering more attention.
While the report about abuse in Protestant churches doesn’t absolve guilty Catholic priests or those who enabled them, said Father Jonathan Morris, it offers a more complete picture. “The problem of sexual abuse has no denominational boundaries,” he wrote.
The AP obtained figures on sex-abuse claims from three companies that insure the majority of Protestant churches in America–Church Mutual Insurance Company,  GuideOne Insurance and Brotherhood Mutual Insurance Company.

 
I suppose if Joe Carter was all that interested in ‘truth’ doing his own research like the AP reporter did – would happen.

Honestly?  The show of true care and compassion towards victims would be along the lines of what Father Jonathan Morris stated above.  There are no denominational boundaries.  Who has MORE sexual perp’s isn’t important – hope for victims IS!  Why are we missing the big picture here?

All you have to do is read some newspapers online, and sadly stories of Pastors – or church personnel – are in there almost everyday because they have been arrested.  Something is clearly wrong with how we approach this subject, and we want to NIT PICK on how to phrase something before we address it?
 
Sadly, it seems ‘context’ isn’t big on the radar of individuals at the Gospel Coalition – among others ‘offended’ by this statement.
 
When you read what Boz had to said in context? The Evangelical Church should be ashamed of its arrogant attitude towards the Catholic Church.
 
The fact that Evangelical churches don’t have the same type of organizational structure as Catholics? It’s a perfectly legitimate smoke screen to use their type of structure to minimize abuse within their own ranks.
 
When you use ‘independence’ of churches? Distances them even further.
 
They are free from some the systematic and vast numbers of victims under the same umbrella. I mean you can’t ‘tie’ all the different churches together – we are all SEPARATE – so our numbers aren’t even CLOSE!
 
These men would make awesome politicians wouldn’t they?

Twist some differences just enough to attempt to show how they are COMPLETELY different….yet they aren’t. Yes, at this point you are supposed to drink the Kool-Aid and feel better about yourself. “We don’t have a child sexual abuse PROBLEM!”   Talk about Slandering the Bride of CHRIST!
 
Lets move on to some aspects SOME actually can acknowledge – while others play their ‘Christian politician game’ shall we?
 
Mr. Tchividjian’s comment:

The greatest failure of the church/Christian organizations when it comes to responding to abuse is institutional self-protection.  Too often Christian institutions have been willing to sacrifice the individual human soul in exchange for the protection of their own reputation.

Is so true!
 
Here are some other comments from a separate interview I found that we see all to often.
 

Why do some churches and other Christian institutions struggle with reporting suspected abuse to the civil authorities?  Regardless of the stated reasons, the common thread running through this struggle is a “fear” that is rooted in self-centeredness.  It is a “fear” of losing the “good reputation” of a ministry, it is the “fear” of losing ministry donors, it is the “fear” of losing congregation members, it is the “fear” of losing a ministry altogether, and all such “fears” are usually wrapped in a fundamental falsehood that reporting such abuse within the Christian community will “damage the cause of Christ”.[ix]  Do you see the great tragedy of this self-centered fear?  Ultimately, fear?   Ultimately, it is an attempt to rob God of his sovereignty and glory by attempting to “protect” identities and possessions.  This is in direct contravention of the Gospel.

God doesn’t need our protection, and sadly they forget the roles in that aspect are reversed.

We need HIM! The lack of faith within these churches just blows my mind. We see Job in the bible, and he had everything taken from him…WELL just about he still had God. Yes, that was all he needed. He still loved and obeyed him. In return, God gave back to him.

Seems preachers can preach about Job, but they don’t have the faith that he did. They would rather twist some scripture around, and throw people under the bus…for their ministry! I guess they feel God wouldn’t restore it.

Don’t you get that is what people are trying to point out?  You aren’t suppose throw people under the bus, and FEAR for our ministry!  Those abused people are more important to God.

Talk about lack of backbone! Churches can survive such an ordeal, and yet some don’t want to be bothered with such details.

A fundamental point that must be understood early on in this discussion is that the crime of child sexual abuse is not merely a personal offense, but rather it is an urgent public concern.  Child sexual abuse does not even fit into the paradigm of which Jesus was speaking in Matthew 18.  Jesus never intended his statements in Matthew 18 to be twisted into the required method for handling murder, rape, torture, kidnapping, or genocide.  Child sexual abuse is not a private matter but rather a public and civic one, rightly under the sword of the civil authority.  All are endangered by this crime against a little one.

There is another teaching of Jesus that regulates how child sexual abuse is to be handled procedurally.  In Romans 13, Jesus tells us through the Apostle Paul that believers are to be subject to the civil authorities.  They swing the sword as God’s ministers, bringing wrath upon evil-doers (Romans 13:1-4).  Child sexual abuse has been deemed to be criminal by the civil authorities deserving of just punishment.

The scourge of child sexual abuse is not just a sin violating the 7th Commandment in Exodus 20:14 and Matthew 5:27-30, but it is also a criminal offense in all 50 States.  It is not a matter which can be handled quietly between two persons or between two families, as was misguidedly done in Genesis 34 and in many churches today.  It is a matter of public alarm, because of its pervasive, extensive, and expansive nature, causing a cascade of misery in countless lives.  Additionally, the God-ordained civil authorities in virtually every jurisdiction mandate in some fashion that suspected child abuse be immediately reported to law enforcement. 

When Christian organizations are to busy nit picking over silly things like figures of speech?  That’s a sad state of affairs.

It seems the Gospel Coalition, and Joe Carter had their feeling hurt over a aspect of Church life that they would rather give lip service to – than acknowledge.  When they would like to be handed stats, and proof – rather than see the more important aspect of helping the hurting? 

They have lost the discernment they claim they have, and others need to use in this area. 

You see the people you whined about Joe?  They need hope – not articles about their use of the English Language.  One is certainly more important to God than the other.  People don’t need your encouragement to correct their wording when they need help either – and yet that is what you are teaching.  You are teaching others, “Ignore them!  They used one of those phrases we all know is ridiculous!’  Is that seriously the message you want to send?

You really need to go back to the basics of our faith.

Why speaking truth in love is not ‘slandering Christ’s Bride’

Where are the Voices?  The Continued Culture of Silence and Protection in American Evangelicalism

Join Boz Tchividjian on Steve Brown Etc. for a discussion of what it takes to recognize, investigate and respond to child sexual abuse in religious institutions.

Janet Mefferd on Joe Carter: Round 2--'Carter's message to Christians is SHUT UP'

Language taken literally Cartoons

Together For Mahaney at Southern Baptist Convention!

Well it seems the Brotherhood of Mega Pastor’s feel its okey dokey to dig their hole just a little bit deeper!  I honestly don’t understand WHERE their logic is!  If you remember Together for the Gospel, and the Gospel Coalition wrote letters of support to a partner in their old boys club, CJ Mahaney.

Sadly, their bad behavior is continuing.  What they seem to be doing is trying to scare others into NOT coming forward for help.  They seem to have forgotten their ‘biblical role’, because it should be the opposite.  They know this as well. 

Keep in mind the lawsuit is still going on, and everything is still ‘alleged’ at this point.

Changes to letters of Support of CJ Mahaney

Together for the Gospel wrote their letter of support on Facebook, and it was taken down after over 100 negative responses were received.  They moved the letter to their website where it can safety stay with NO comments from anyone.

In line with how they tend to control their environments it didn’t surprise me to find that they also decided to change their letter around a bit.  Wartsburg Watch and Spiritual Sounding Board is who I noticed sounding the charge! 

When first posted on May 23, 2013, the statement included this paragraph:
“A Christian leader, charged with any credible, serious, and direct wrongdoing, would usually be well advised to step down from public ministry. No such accusation of direct wrongdoing was ever made against C.J. Mahaney. Instead, he was charged with founding a ministry and for teaching doctrines and principles that are held to be true by vast millions of American evangelicals …”
Checked on the morning of June 6, it was discovered that two sentences — “No such accusation of direct wrongdoing was ever made against C.J. Mahaney. Instead, he was charged with founding a ministry and for teaching doctrines and principles that are held to be true by vast millions of American evangelicals” — had been removed from the statement. This is how the new version reads: “A Christian leader, charged with any credible, serious, and direct wrongdoing, would usually be well advised to step down from public ministry. We believe this lawsuit failed that test.”
However, the date on the statement remained May 23. No reference to an update was included on the changed statement.

Shh!  I don’t think we were suppose to notice!  You have to admit the second is a better cleaned up version.  I mean their martyrhood was showing a bit to much on the original.  I guess they figured ‘charged with founding a ministry’, and teaching its doctrines and principals was a bit over the top – even for those that respected them.

What they never did mention was the fact that CJ Mahaney was the lead pastor at the churches (or one of them) while the covering up of the abuse was happening.  How he was allegedly part of the encouragement of the church members NOT to involve the authorities when this was happening.  THAT was why he was mentioned in the lawsuit, and that’s a far cry from ‘founding a ministry’.  Habitual cover up of abuse is what he is accused of after all!

Boz Tchividjian serves as Executive Director of GRACE (Godly Response to Abuse in the Christian Environment), which he helped found.  The purpose of GRACE is "to educate and equip the faith community to correctly respond to sexual abuse disclosures, while also providing practical guidance to churches on how to protect children."  In addition to this position, he serves as a law professor at Liberty University School of Law.  Boz Tchividjian is the third eldest grandchild of Billy Graham.

He was interviewed by Janet Mefferd:

In case you missed the interview, you can listen to it here (starting at the 20:30 mark).  Janet Mefferd explained that there have been cries from a lot of ordinary Christians who are calling on evangelical leaders to address what she describes as "American evangelicalism's biggest sex scandal to date".

Documents and Audio Surface

Sadly, since all of this started Wartsburg Watch also got to listen to an audio for Sovereign Grace Ministries discussing how they as the church need to handle these cases of abuse as they come up.  The church’s policy is also on a 17 page document.  Sigh!

It was sadly much the same type of garbage that has got so many other organizations in trouble.

The church leaders feel they need to decide if its abuse FIRST OFF.  They will approach the other party – the perp I guess to get their side of the story.  They call their lawyer to see how to protect the church.  They get all their ducks in a row, and then if they feel the case has merit?  They tell the family to go to the police, because after all the authorities don’t like getting information ‘second hand’.  They will not notify anyone else in the church, because I guess they feel its none of their business.  Encourage the family to hush as well.  Then the perp and the victim get handed two different pastors to ‘counsel’ with. 

There is more to it of course, and that is my nutshell version!

Problem is they are mandatory reporters, and the reputation of the church SHOULD be the last thing on their mind!  The lawsuit happened, because they decided ‘it wasn’t abuse’ and buried it allegedly.  Sadly, of course cries for help were ignored.

SBC getting Ready for Convention, and they REALLY would rather deal with the Boy Scouts!

Another interesting part to this story is that the Southern Baptist Convention is coming up again.  The mega pastors didn’t get the ‘support’ they were looking for, and no doubt they want to put this to bed.  It’s not going to happen, because people are crying out! 

They want to discuss the Boy Scouts agreement to allow homosexual scouts into their troops, and NOT sexual abuse within the church!  Notice how they don’t want to take that darn SPECK from their eye, but rather deal with the LOG in the Boy Scouts?  How biblical right?!

 David Clohessy, national director of SNAP -- the Survivors Network of those Abused by Priests – said May 28 that religious leaders voicing support for embattled Pastor C.J. Mahaney, named in a lawsuit recently thrown out of a Maryland court for legal reasons, ought to be ashamed. (Keep in mind it was the Status of Limitations that had run out, but amended lawsuit has been filed)

Peter Lumpkins  has a Resolution on Sexual Abuse of Children - Proposed to the 2013 Southern Baptist Convention meeting in Houston, Texas.  I don’t honestly know if they will even acknowledge him under the circumstances.

Meanwhile, Amy and her husband are Houston leaders for (Snap) Survivors Network of Those Abused by Priests (and other clergy).   They belong to the Houston First Baptist Church.   She was planning on attending the Southern Baptist Convention, and holding up a picture of a sexual abuse survivor to being awareness of victims within the Baptist’s churches.    They already has sent a letter to the convention asking for time on this issue (letter is attached on her site).  They get a phone call from their pastor, and have a meeting with the pastor of their large church that they never spoke to prior.  Part of her transcript is below, and she also get a call from the police department concerned about her 'protest':

I saw your blog.
I'm confused. You don't see it as a problem? [speaking out about child sexual abuse by Baptist clergy, about Baptist churches that cover up such abuse, about silence from SBC leaders about this abuse, about the vocal support of another evangelical pastor C.J. Mahaney accused in a lawsuit by 11 plaintiffs of covering up child sex abuse, and planning an awareness event next week at the Southern Baptist Convention annual meeting in Houston]
What good is it going to do, you standing outside the SBC?
What good will it do if the SBC president did issue a statement on abuse?
We're not like the Methodists. [each Baptist church is locally autonomous]
How can you say that? [that child sexual abuse within Baptist churches is a systemic problem]
You may be seen as fringe.

A comment from the article:

At the meeting with my husband the next day, Doug brought up the subject of me stepping down (from her role within the youth ministry), and he told my husband that I had told him I was stepping down but that he had said to think about it. Doug told my husband that after thinking about it overnight, he thought me stepping down "is for the best."

My husband asked him, "Why?" Doug replied, "You don't see it as a problem?"
My husband said "No."

Sadly, it seems her pastor feels towing the line with "Together for Maheney".   Another quote:

“They agree with us that child sexual abuse is bad, and they don't want me to stop what I'm doing, but the church doesn't support me raising awareness by pointing out the problem within SBC churches and pastors that cover abuse up by failing to report,” she wrote. “It's not a problem for me to point out these issues with Catholic churches or Penn State, just don't point the finger at my own Southern Baptist Convention.”

Here we go again with this ‘autonomous’ church stuff.  If you remember the Tina Anderson and Chuck Phelps story?  Their Independent Fundamental Baptist churches also use the ‘autonomous’ aspect to NOT deal directly with this sin as well. 

Did they NOT figure out that just isn’t going to HAPPEN? Why is it these preacher boys want everyone to face their sin, and decide where the sin sniffing needs to begin – yet can’t face it themselves?

No, Its not easy to have a friend of yours facing these awful charges.  Common sense needs to be used in these types of circumstances, and yet Chicago type Gangster stuff does instead!  Where is the benevolent leadership?

They are so WORRIED that the darn feminists were going to take them down, and RUIN life as we know it … and look who is doing it all by themselves?  Is this the ‘MANHOOD’ we have been hearing about?

Seriously.  SHAME ON YOU!



_____

*Post as been edited to add more detail.

Brotherhood of Mega Pastors says there is no Culpability on their part!

Claims presented in a civil lawsuit seeking financial compensation are beyond the ability of the public to render judgment. Often, such claims are even beyond the ability of a court to deliberate. To comment on such claims is irresponsible, since no one apart from the court and the parties directly involved has any ability to evaluate the claims presented. If the filing of civil litigation against a Christian ministry or leader is in itself reason for separation and a rush to judgment, no ministry or minister is safe from destruction at any time. Furthermore, the effort to try such a case in the court of public opinion prior to any decision rendered by an authorized court is likewise irresponsible  (Full Transcript with comments Here, and Here   - Thank you Bill Kinnon)

Sovereign Grace Ministries (Or SGM) has been a hot topic all around the blog world, and some news outlets as well.  Sadly, it hasn’t been in a good way.  Claims of alleged (word for lawyers) sexual abuse, physical abuse, emotional abuse, spiritual abuse were brought forth towards C. J. Mahaney’s Church, or network of churches – naming himself and some of his staff.    The two main responses from ‘friends’ of SGM are at best Disingenuous. 

The lawsuit itself had over 146 claims of abuse, and 16 churches have left the network of churches claiming C. J. Mahaney is not above reproach. 

The above quoted paragraph is from a statement issued from powerful friends: Mark Dever, Ligion Duncan, and Albert Mohler.  They originally posted in on the “Together for the Gospel” facebook page, and because of all the negative feedback…it was removed.  Yes, they did attempt to scrub it clean, but the link above shows the screen shot with comments.  They did re-issue their statement on their website that does not allow comments.  Think what you may about that!

I read the above with dismay, because it isn’t hard to find articles on their own sites commenting, questioning, and making decisions on lawsuits PRIOR to an authorized court doing so.    Being that C. J. Mahaney is their friend?  WELL it doesn’t take a rocket scientist to tell which they prefer in this case.  Their approach is pretty manipulative if you think about it. 

Within the last week a civil lawsuit that was filed was dismissed due to the crimes being committed outside the statue of limitations (in other words – too long ago).  Most of claims were dismissed, but thankfully not all.  If you read the statement from the brotherhood of the Mega Pastors – you would think that means there is nothing to the suit at all.    Thankfully, in more and more areas the statue of limitations in these types of cases are being removed.  They are realizing when you are harmed as a child in these types of circumstances you aren’t in the position to go out and FILE the civil suit are you?  Let’s read what Boz Tchividjian founder and Executive Director of GRACE: Godly Response to Abuse in the Christian Environment and is a former child abuse prosecutor has to say about their comments and the Statue of Limitation:

The statement by T4G fails to mention that this lawsuit was dismissed for one reason and one reason only…expiration of the statute of limitation. Isn’t it tragic that the reason why this suit was dismissed – taking too long to file – was the very objective of these church leaders allegedly had when they discouraged these individuals and families from stepping forward. - Boz Tchividjian  From G.R.A.C.E.

The dropping of most of the cases was a big blow to the survivors, because what they were trying to show was a pattern of systematic cover up of abuse.  Please note that YES the civil suit was dropped in some cases, but the criminal one is still on-going.  It makes no sense that they can comment NOW when it clearly isn’t completely over yet.  They may have just shot themselves in the foot with that one.  Julie Anne goes into more details about the legal end of this on her blog Spiritual Sounding Board.  What C. J. Mahaney’s friends seem to be hinting at is – there was no case.    Once again I say – Disingenuous!